I know what you're thinking. "Did he cross the "t" in Eastwood?" Well to tell you the truth in all this excitement I kinda lost track myself. But being this is a 2023 Leaf Pop Century signed Clint Eastwood card, one of the most expensive cards ever issued and would blow your wallet clean apart, you've gotta ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya, punk?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Bill Mullins,

Clint is 93 years old so maybe his signature is not the best...

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Mullins:
I know what you're thinking. "Did he cross the "t" in Eastwood?" Well to tell you the truth in all this excitement I kinda lost track myself. But being this is a 2023 Leaf Pop Century signed Clint Eastwood card, one of the most expensive cards ever issued and would blow your wallet clean apart, you've gotta ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya, punk?

quote:

Originally posted by Tommy C:
Clint is 93 years old so maybe his signature is not the best...

Actually, looking at all the examples on Official Pix his sig looks great for his age.

The difference in the height of the L and the way the T was crossed stuck out to me too -- also some of the 'Es' in Eastwood are really blocky others aren't blocky at all.

I'm very curious to hear if you get a response -- I wonder if they'll even admit to being the source.

quote:

Originally posted by webjon:
The difference in the height of the L and the way the T was crossed stuck out to me too -- also some of the 'Es' in Eastwood are really blocky others aren't blocky at all.

I'm very curious to hear if you get a response -- I wonder if they'll even admit to being the source.

Well they have to admit to being the source, it is his first and only private signing.

Here is a video of Ari Lehman talking about this on Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/10007...tid=rS40aB7S9Ucbxw6v

I find the video very credible -- I was expecting something far less detailed and more like 'I've never seen these cards before, they must be forgeries.'

I really wish they would out whoever the third party was for these signatures and identify which other signatures were supplied.

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

quote:

Originally posted by webjon:
The difference in the height of the L and the way the T was crossed stuck out to me too -- also some of the 'Es' in Eastwood are really blocky others aren't blocky at all.

I'm very curious to hear if you get a response -- I wonder if they'll even admit to being the source.

Well they have to admit to being the source, it is his first and only private signing.

So here's why they won't and/or even if they are the source, it doesn't really matter.

Let's say that Leaf did use them to get some number of stickers signed, or even other paper to make Eastwood cuts eventually.

Do they know how many Eastwood autograph cards were released, or how many autograph stickers might be held back for future products? Do they know if the stickers released are exclusively from them or if there might be other sources mixed in? If they got paid for 10 signatures and happen to see 12 Pop Century autograph cards, do they know which 2 are not from them?

I think the answer would be NO for all those questions, unless they want to admit to something more. Leaf is the one who knows. They know how many signatures they bought, who they bought from, how many cards are out, and how many signatures they still have, if any.

Leaf is the one company ultimately responsible for the cards and the authenticity of any autographs, even if it was third-party vender obtained. So this isn't just about how high are his L's, it's how reliable is the whole process.

I would have to believe that Leaf did its due diligence on the most expensive new signer in Pop Century Metal 2023. If it didn't, if there are abnormalities, someone in authority is going to have to say it, or someone with a higher pay grade than me is going to have to prove it.

For what it's worth, someone over on Blowout is claiming that Leaf is claiming that the Eastwood autographs were obtained directly from his agent. They are also claiming that Leaf is claiming that the Lehman autographs (and all other Pop Century autos) are genuine, and he just forgot about doing them a couple of years ago.

If I was a card maker, I would document the hell out of my autograph signers because it is too easy to question anything and too hard to prove anything, either way.

So have you heard about Leaf Decadence coming in October 2023. I thought Pop Century Metal was high-end, but apparently it was just the warmup act.

This one will have three framed autograph cards per box and one will be a multi signature. They are limited to 10 per color. No box price indicated yet. Update: I found one listing at $999.95 per box so far. Which means every framed card will have to average out to $333.33 to just break even.

I was going to open another thread, but why bother! This is just an extension of 2023 Pop Century Metal, with all the same stickers and probably a couple of new names. It's also the answer to why all the better signers in Metal are on 1/1 cards. They were held back for this one. Leaf must be feeling pretty slick.

Too slick. Who wants a framed autograph card? Who wants a card that is just rows of stickers with different color borders? Who is going to keep breaking 2023 Metal when most of the good stuff has been held back for Decadence? And who thinks that any generic product like Leaf Decadence is worth this kind of money?

Decadence is defined as luxuriously self-indulgent and symbolic of a decline in values or culture. It is not a good thing to be decadent, but it's also stupid. Maybe Leaf picked an accurate title by mistake.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Raven,

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:
For what it's worth, someone over on Blowout is claiming that Leaf is claiming that the Eastwood autographs were obtained directly from his agent. They are also claiming that Leaf is claiming that the Lehman autographs (and all other Pop Century autos) are genuine, and he just forgot about doing them a couple of years ago.

If I was a card maker, I would document the hell out of my autograph signers because it is too easy to question anything and too hard to prove anything, either way.

Interesting, because one thing my response from Official Pix is that he signed stickers during their event.

Unfortunately they could not give witness to the more questionable Eastwood signature and said that there is no authentication trail between Official Pix and the Pop Century customer who ends up with cards from their events. I even suggested a few detailed photos of the signed sheets would go a long way.

OP is also aware of the Ari Lehman situation.

quote:

So have you heard about Leaf Decadence coming in October 2023. I thought Pop Century Metal was high-end, but apparently it was just the warmup act.

They didn't release a Red/White/Blue set this year....wonder if this is a replacement?

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
Interesting, because one thing my response from Official Pix is that he signed stickers during their event.

Unfortunately, they could not give witness to the more questionable Eastwood signature and said that there is no authentication trail between Official Pix and the Pop Century customer who ends up with cards from their events.

Yeah, that's exactly what I would expect them to say. Once the signed sticker or signed item goes back to Leaf it could turn up anywhere. Only Leaf knows all sources and the number of all stickers and/or cuts signed.

So any serious examination of authenticity has to start first with the card maker and work its way back to the sources, because the sources can all claim ignorance of the final product.

Either you have faith in the integrity of the process, or you won't believe any of it. Judging by the number of years Pop Century autograph cards have been around, I mostly have faith. Can mistakes be made? Sure, but hopefully not often.

Generally speaking are licensed cards a trusted source? I say yes.

However; integrity in the face of released blank autograph cards, autopen sigs and proven fake autographs are a clear indication that something is missing in the process. We have been introduced to third party vendors with no clue to their motives in providing X number of autographs to X card company. We already know that the company is more concerned with affidavits over what the signature looks like. Not to mention that every grading company offers grades that circumvent authenticity. In an honest world authentication companies would be a conflict to the card manufacturer and I just don't have a warm and fuzzy that this is the case.

Now we know that a source of autographs is vague and has no accountability for signatures provided to a card company.

Pop century has put me in a position to check out any signature that they have to offer.

Decadence bothers me, but only because I thought Pop Century was watered down. All of those 1/1 autographs really leave a bad taste in my mouth. Some of the signers have a lot of 1/1s -- others are super rare. I feel the way the set was advertised was misleading and a change from previous years.

Additionally, and more importantly, the Ari Lehman situation has really eroded my trust in Leaf and Pop Century. There is still time for Leaf to correct this, but time is running out.

Right now it is a he said / he said situation. . . and I personally have found Lehman far more compelling than the statements from Leaf.

If I don't trust Leaf to handle Ari Lehman autographs then what autographs would I trust them with? I mean seriously -- Lehman seems to be readily accessible. This isn't like trying to get a reclusive celebrity to sign for you.

Also -- what are the chances the Jason picture from this card is licensed?

You bring up a good point that I have been applying to card companies for awhile.

Being 99% accurate is great but how you respond to
the 1% of problems says so much more.

quote:

Originally posted by webjon:

Also -- what are the chances the Jason picture from this card is licensed?

I think they get images from stock photo companies, and many of them have on-set photography from films. I don't know the legality of what you can and can't do with those photos you purchase.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:

quote:

Originally posted by webjon:

Also -- what are the chances the Jason picture from this card is licensed?

I think they get images from stock photo companies, and many of them have on-set photography from films. I don't know the legality of what you can and can't do with those photos you purchase.

Yeah they pulled several character pics from films this year which I am actually happy to see. I am sure there is a line they can step up to without being liable. Not sure who wants to remember Travolta in "Staying Alive" but there it is.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mykdude,

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
Not sure who wants to remember Travolta in "Staying Alive" but there it is.

Hey, I do and did get it. "Staying Alive". "Saturday Night Fever", same character.

Seriously, it wasn't that long ago Travolta was regarded as a big signer. Never worth it to me before. With this batch, he's going as almost an average autograph card. It's the signature that counts and these are more than reasonably priced if you search a bit. There are quite a few of them available.

And I would rather have a cheap Travolta in "Staying Alive" than an overpriced De Niro wearing what looks like a trash can cover on his head in last year's batch.

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
Not sure who wants to remember Travolta in "Staying Alive" but there it is.

Hey, I do and did get it. "Staying Alive". "Saturday Night Fever", same character.

Seriously, it wasn't that long ago Travolta was regarded as a big signer. Never worth it to me before. With this batch, he's going as almost an average autograph card. It's the signature that counts and these are more than reasonably priced if you search a bit. There are quite a few of them available.

And I would rather have a cheap Travolta in "Staying Alive" than an overpriced De Niro wearing what looks like a trash can cover on his head in last year's batch.

I think that is pretty much it and nails the real definition of "rare" in the non sports autograph world. Travolta has become a regular...aside from his on card Battlefield Earth sig all the rest tend to get tossed into the same pile.

I don't care for the DeNiro photo either but if it turns out to be the only one he signs......

Which by the way I paid too much for and taught me a little patience for this year's release.