quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
And now, a new US Post Office policy will almost assuredly have further negative impact on many sellers willingness to send items outside of the United States. As a result of customs forms being filled out so haphazardly by many senders, the postal clerk now must manually enter the address the item is being sent to into their computer.
This may not seem like a big deal at first glance, but it can actually take a few minutes per package, so imagine how much time per week this will require from seller who sends packages out of the United States on a regular basis. Unlike regular packages that can be sent using the automated machine at the post office, or else be picked up from your home by the letter carrier, packages with customs forms have to be mailed at the post office in a process whose time has just been significantly increased.

I hate to say it, but look for at least some sellers who used to gladly ship items out of the U.S. to soon discontinue doing so, especially lower priced items. It is just no longer cost or time effective to offer international service, a real shame.

I may be one of those sellers who will no longer ship internationally anymore. About two weeks ago I went to send a card to the UK. It weighed under an ounce. But it was a little thick so they called it a parcel. I had to fill out a customs form. On top of that, I go back and then spend 3 minutes waiting for the postal worker to type everything. All this hassle for a $5 card was absolutely not worth it.

Much of the time when I sell off a bunch of cards at one time and have one bidder win many of the items. I usually end up having those bidders be international. While I don't usually mind, I did recently experience a relatively big loss. $60 worth of cards that I sent to Germany went missing. The buyer was completely understanding and luckily I had replacements. The buyer even paid for tracking on this second shipment.

I usually get a great deal of international bidders because I don't overcharge for shipping (since I offer free shipping in US, I don't mind a minor loss on international as well). However, with these new regulations and horror stories of international scammers, and I do not want to force international buyers to pay an extra $12 for shipping, I am highly considering restricting my selling within the US sadly.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Taylor:
While I appreciate the risks involved in sending items untracked, it would have been one thing to claim to have not received them, but to actually leave positive feedback praising the cards & service then claim your credit card has an unauthorised payment really sticks in the throat.

I sympathize with you completely, Dave. My post wasn't at all to say, "tough, you're out of luck", but rather just to provide some advice to anyone who could use it going forward.

The problem with a person even having left you positive feedback for an item only to later request and receive a refund for the item is that they can simply say, "Sure, I posted positive feedback on the item, but I was confused and thought I was posting it on a different item which I'd won and did receive. Dave's item, I never got, so I want my money back") which is why the tracking is essential.

As Marco wisely mentioned in his post regarding this, a lot of people, not wishing to pass on the high cost of tracking on international orders and at the same time not wanting to lose international sales are willing to take on the risk of sending items without tracking, and just chalk up the ocassional loss as part of the cost of doing business. And that's fine, I get that, and used to be one of those until something happened that utterly soured me on the whole idea of it.

A fellow from Canada had won a pair of Iron Man master sets from me, one from the first movie and another from the second. Back then, I would offer the buyer two shipping options, regular 1st Class for about $8 or that same service plus Registered mail which included the tracking at a total cost of $20. I explained on my invoice that items usually arrived fine without tracking, so they could use the lower price and feel relatively comfortable in doing so. On the other hand, if they'd ever had an item lost, they might want to consider the tracking service to protect their purchase.

The buyer opted for the lower rate and I sent the sets out. Cut to a couple of weeks later, and I get the "Item Not Received" email at which point Ebay asks me for the tracking number which I don't have since that's what the buyer decided (and paid for). I explained that and directed them to our Ebay message system exchanges which I felt clearly indicated the lower rate meant the cards were being sent at the buyer's own risk and at his own direction, but it didn't matter. No tracking means no defense for the seller. Ebay is an arbitrator here, but not really. They know that a seller who gets burned is likely to chalk it up to the cost of doing business and go right on selling while a buyer who feels they've been burned probably ain't comin' back. Right or wrong, Ebay values its buyers much more than it does its sellers.

Still, none of that is what really bothered me about the transaction. Rather, it was due to the fact that to minimize my losses as much as I could, I had offered to send the buyer a replacement of both sets at my expense, if they merely cancelled the chargeback. When they refused to do that (or even cancel the original transaction so I could at least get the fees I paid Ebay returned to me for purposes of non-sale), it was then I knew for sure that the buyer HAD received the cards, but used the Ebay system to get the cards and their money back.
Why wouldn't they want the cards they had ordered only a few weeks previously, especially at no further expense? (in addition to it being the right thing to do considering I'd only sent them without tracking in the first place to save them money, and in no way to further enrich myself.)

No amount of reason could convince Ebay that I'd done everything in the interest of the buyer from the very start. Only a refund from my account of money that I'd earned would settle the matter. I did not make the buyer wait the full time I could've until Ebay automatically released the funds to them. I issued the refund myself instead. Even then, they still refused to cancel the auction through Ebay so that I could at least get my fees back since this was a non-sale ultimately. The buyers reason for not even providing this small mercy: they wanted to "protect" themselves. From what at that point, I had no idea, but no longer had the energy to ask.

Even so, it was never the money I lost on that one transaction that ultimately changed the way I do things, but rather the awful feeling of being exposed I'd get from then on every time I'd send something without tracking, the worse part being that the only time I would send something that way was to save the buyer shipping costs and also not to discourage non-U.S. bids. Eventually, I just couldn't accept the notion that anyone unscrupulous enough to see tracking had not been used on a package could proceed to very easily use the buyer-centric Ebay system to ask for and receive a refund for the item and the postage cost, with no questions asked as long as I was unable to provide a tracking number. Even a printed postal receipt and a matching dated, fully addressed postmarked customs form does not indicate proof of mailing where Ebay is concerned.

In terms of actual dollars, there is no doubt that I have lost bids from overseas buyers who (very reasonably) don't want to pay $15+ in shipping for a single card, and just don't bid when they would've before, when I was able to charge $3 shipping for the same thing. Those lost bids almost certainly equate to significantly more money that I'd have lost in the same period had I simply gone on sending international items without tracking, despite the occasional chargeback I would've been hit with for non-receipt of the item (again, whether the item had actually been received or not). The problem with that is that basic fair-play is in my core and informs my every action, and what had happened to me with the Canadian bidder was such an assault against basic fairness as I saw it, that I ultimately determined that at least if I lost money with my decision to increase international shipping to the necessary level, that was my decision, and one I could live with (as opposed to leaving myself at the mercy of someone willing to game the system to keep both the cards I'd sent them and the money they paid me, and even the postage I'd used to send the item.).

My view is that Ebay should allow sellers to offer low shipping to International buyers. As long as the seller then uploads a picture of the official dated postal receipt indicating when an item was shipped along with a matching postmarked customs receipt showing where it was sent, and it is then lost in the mail, Ebay should use money from the own "Buyer Protection" fund to issue the refund. Sure, they'd be out money from time to time when items were lost, but the vast majority of items would not be lost, and the increase in international bids would allow Ebay to make a lot more money in fees as a result of increased sales prices, more than enough to pay for any lost items they are reimbursing a buyer for.

Ebay's "Buyer Protection" program provides for the confidence in their purchases the modern online buyer has come to expect, and despite ocassional misuses of it as we've seen in this thread, it is of great benefit to the seller as well, i.e., more and more confident bidders means higher bids on items. Even so, I think its time for them to develop a "Seller Protection" which, similarly, would also greatly benefit buyers.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: chesspieceface,

Hi

I am a UK buyer who has had a few items go astray recently. One has shown up 10 weeks later after the seller and I came to an arrangement on the deal. I am now having to contavt him to let him know the card had arrived.

Just this week I had to deal with a seller accusesing me of trying to scam him after they had sent the card and I claimed it had never been received and opened a case on ebay. The card arrived on Friday.

Two points to this story.

1) I had to open the case in the second example due to the time limits on doing so impossed by ebay.
2) The delay on these two items have a common theme. They we held by UK Customs to charge VAT on them as they were of $27. One had been received by them on 23rd August but only reached my on Friday.

The explanation I have been given by them is that they are short staffed and this is now causing delays in customs clearing private packets and parcels.

I can understand why many sellers do not ship internationally and I always appreciate those will do so. Unfortunately there are some who abuse the power that ebay gives them as buyers.

Please don't judge all international buyers by those few who do not play fair. Maybe a good buyer listing is required for sellers to use to indentify sellers that they have a good relationship with and are trustworthy buyers.

gk

quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Dave Taylor:

A fellow from Canada had won a pair of Iron Man master sets from me, one from the first movie and another from the second. Back then, I would offer the buyer two shipping options, regular 1st Class for about $8 or that same service plus Registered mail which included the tracking at a total cost of $20. I explained on my invoice that items usually arrived fine without tracking, so they could use the lower price and feel relatively comfortable in doing so. On the other hand, if they'd ever had an item lost, they might want to consider the tracking service to protect their purchase.

One high cost items I will cover the extra shipping costs my self if they elect not to. I think of it more as insurance to protect myself from fraudulent claims like the ones talked about in this thread.

Yeah customs are the big sticking point with a lot of delays. Some times you get someone new to international shipping and they dont get that.

Tip for not over paying for International shipping on cards is to use the automated systems or to print the labels from and just drop them off at the post rather than going thru the attendants.

I sell International. In the marketplaces like eBay or eCrater never have a big problem. But the sales directly by e-mail can be a headache. It takes a lot of time and sometimes a lost of time. You try to be more flexible with your terms, but in the end some buyers doesn't respect the terms of the sale.

For now it will not stop me to sell International. Next year maybe I will not see anymore International sales thanks to the USPS.

Thankfully, I have not been hit with a rash of bogus "buyers" and still am happy to ship internationally on anthing. I do mandate that anything over $75 goes via priority and anything over $125 goes via express (single cards only, shipping for sets are priced accordingly)...unless the buyer has someone to ship to in the States and I will charge my standard domestic rate.

Does an occasional card go missing? Sure, but not enough to cut off the rest of the collecting world.

BTW, I process ALL shipping online and never have to wait at the post office...heck, I rarely make the trip there as I can just put it in the outgoing mail.

So, my case with ebay is still ongoing, I countered the buyer's case against me with one of my own. Ebay sent me a very nice email saying how I was a respected entity and had a 100% perfect feedback over 7 years and how commendable that was, and essentially that they are on my side and will put the buyer's case on hold for two more weeks for the item to clear customs.

Fingers crossed it will ever get through, annoyingly I will most likely get bad feedback from the buyer for this.. but I really didn't have much choice...

You've got to wonder about these "missing mailings". I currently have a feedback rating of 569 which probably represents well inn excess of a 1,000 transactions over 12 years. Of those 80% would have been where I am the buyer and 20% the seller.

Despite these stats and the fact that I am trading from New Zealand, I can honestly state (hand on heart) I have never ever lost a single parcel, letter or mailing in either direction over that period. What's more, the 100% strike rate is nothing more than I would expect.

If as many mailings as everyone is talking about really did happen then the local mail distribution centre must have one of the largest and most expensive card collection in history.

In my humble opinion (IMHO)Claims of 'lost' mailings are 99.9% scams. Ebay should tag anyone's account for all to see that they have had a 'lost mailing' claim, both buyers and sellers. I tell you what, if I saw just one claim stated it would put me off dealing with that person forever.

quote:

Despite these stats and the fact that I am trading from New Zealand, I can honestly state (hand on heart) I have never ever lost a single parcel, letter or mailing in either direction over that period. What's more, the 100% strike rate is nothing more than I would expect.

You have been lucky though. Trading from Australia (both buying and selling), my loss rate is something like 1 in 200. There's been a few others that were false claims. However, it is definitely true that some items genuinely disappear. I am happy to take the risk as a buyer (that is, I don't claim against paypal/eBay if it doesn't arrive) and as a seller/trader with people on Card Talk or other boards (that is, will reimburse if it doesn't arrive). From eBay though, there's several buyers that I won't sell to and a couple of countries that I require tracked shipping.

I've also had more than 100 international book purchases, with 2 lots gone missing and 1 ruined by water. You'd think books would be harder to misplace than small cards!

quote:

Originally posted by btlfannz:
You've got to wonder about these "missing mailings". I currently have a feedback rating of 569 which probably represents well inn excess of a 1,000 transactions over 12 years. Of those 80% would have been where I am the buyer and 20% the seller.

Despite these stats and the fact that I am trading from New Zealand, I can honestly state (hand on heart) I have never ever lost a single parcel, letter or mailing in either direction over that period. What's more, the 100% strike rate is nothing more than I would expect.

If as many mailings as everyone is talking about really did happen then the local mail distribution centre must have one of the largest and most expensive card collection in history.

In my humble opinion (IMHO)Claims of 'lost' mailings are 99.9% scams. Ebay should tag anyone's account for all to see that they have had a 'lost mailing' claim, both buyers and sellers. I tell you what, if I saw just one claim stated it would put me off dealing with that person forever.

My friend used to work at the post office lost property and yes they have warehouses of items. The vast majority of cases the address label gets damaged so they have no idea who to send it to. They will open the package and look for a return address if there isnt one they hold onto it for someone to make a claim. If after I think a year, the items are sold/dumped.
If you are sending something expensive always a good idea to include a return address inside the parcel.
I also at least once a month get something through the door addressed to someone else. Im honest enough to pass these on, but im sure there are plenty of people who dont.

Out of about 400 ebay transactions I have one ive purchased and one i have sold go missing. So 1 in 200 for me too.

THe addition of an address inside is a good one and one I NEED to do. I go through fits but am never consistant. Anything that can help get a poor package back to it's mom!

quote:

Originally posted by STCardGeek:
THe addition of an address inside is a good one and one I NEED to do. I go through fits but am never consistant. Anything that can help get a poor package back to it's mom!

That is a good idea. I never thought of that.

I've had only 2 cards go missing coming in from the US. The first seller accused me of lying (the letter was registered, showed it had entered the country then nothing...) and would not respond any further. Got the money back via Paypal but still felt guilty even though I genuinely did not receive the card. no names, but the seller is very well established. He also banned me from his auctions. I undertsand the frustration, but you can't assume everyone's a crook. Plus, the item was insured so he would have gotten his money back anyway!

The second seller went above and beyond to help. never had to start a claim. We waited a fair amount of time just in case, then he sent me a replacement which, thankfully, arrived. I've since bought more cards from the seller specifically because he was so understanding, and will buy more in the future despite maybe being able to buy them cheaper elsewhere. A trusted seller is just as important as being a trusted buyer.

quote:

Originally posted by Kris Gibson:
I've had only 2 cards go missing coming in from the US. The first seller accused me of lying (the letter was registered, showed it had entered the country then nothing...) and would not respond any further. Got the money back via Paypal but still felt guilty even though I genuinely did not receive the card. no names, but the seller is very well established. He also banned me from his auctions. I undertsand the frustration, but you can't assume everyone's a crook. Plus, the item was insured so he would have gotten his money back anyway!

The second seller went above and beyond to help. never had to start a claim. We waited a fair amount of time just in case, then he sent me a replacement which, thankfully, arrived. I've since bought more cards from the seller specifically because he was so understanding, and will buy more in the future despite maybe being able to buy them cheaper elsewhere. A trusted seller is just as important as being a trusted buyer.

I agree. I had a package go missing once and the seller's response was "too bad. I did my part". The package finally arrived a week later but I've never bought from the seller again because of his response.

quote:

Originally posted by Neilsy:
My friend used to work at the post office lost property and yes they have warehouses of items. The vast majority of cases the address label gets damaged so they have no idea who to send it to. They will open the package and look for a return address if there isnt one they hold onto it for someone to make a claim. If after I think a year, the items are sold/dumped.
If you are sending something expensive always a good idea to include a return address inside the parcel.

I write the buyer's name and address on a post-it or small piece of paper and tape it to the top holder before shipping. So far, I've never had a damaged parcel or an item that was separated from the parcel, but the few extra minutes it takes to do this gives me some peace of mind.

I have had two bad experiences with ebay, I don't bother selling any more. One was a Buffy scythe i was short on money and sold it. 300 some dollars i sent it to her, she complained she didn't like the packaging an shipping of it. So she opened a pay-pal dispute and wanted her money back and to send back the product. Well pay pal took the money out of my account, she said she shipped it back to me and I never got it. Lost 300 and the Buffy scythe I was so disappointed i didn't even want to sell it but to loose on both ends. Same thing happened when I tried to sell my furry bones.Then my feedback went down and now i feel so dirty lol

quote:

Originally posted by Dex1186:
I have had two bad experiences with ebay, I don't bother selling any more. One was a Buffy scythe i was short on money and sold it. 300 some dollars i sent it to her, she complained she didn't like the packaging an shipping of it. So she opened a pay-pal dispute and wanted her money back and to send back the product. Well pay pal took the money out of my account, she said she shipped it back to me and I never got it. Lost 300 and the Buffy scythe I was so disappointed i didn't even want to sell it but to loose on both ends. Same thing happened when I tried to sell my furry bones.Then my feedback went down and now i feel so dirty lol

I had a buyer decide a month after she received the cards I sent her decide that they "weren't as described", PayPal had her send them back to me (at her expense) and the money wasn't refunded to her until I confirmed that the cards were in my possession. That's exactly what they should have done with your case.

quote:

Originally posted by Miss Lizzy:

quote:

Originally posted by Dex1186:
I have had two bad experiences with ebay, I don't bother selling any more. One was a Buffy scythe i was short on money and sold it. 300 some dollars i sent it to her, she complained she didn't like the packaging an shipping of it. So she opened a pay-pal dispute and wanted her money back and to send back the product. Well pay pal took the money out of my account, she said she shipped it back to me and I never got it. Lost 300 and the Buffy scythe I was so disappointed i didn't even want to sell it but to loose on both ends. Same thing happened when I tried to sell my furry bones.Then my feedback went down and now i feel so dirty lol

I had a buyer decide a month after she received the cards I sent her decide that they "weren't as described", PayPal had her send them back to me (at her expense) and the money wasn't refunded to her until I confirmed that the cards were in my possession. That's exactly what they should have done with your case.

This was way back about 6 or more years ago, Paypal said she supplied a tracking number. But again i never saw the tracking or the package to this day I have no idea what happened.

quote:

My friend used to work at the post office lost property and yes they have warehouses of items. The vast majority of cases the address label gets damaged so they have no idea who to send it to. They will open the package and look for a return address if there isnt one they hold onto it for someone to make a claim. If after I think a year, the items are sold/dumped.

As a seller. I always include an Invoice with the cards. Even if you buy a single card I add an Invoice. Also if I send using 2 envelopes, the interior envelope has the address of the buyer and mine.

As a buyer. Seriously, every year I see less and less Invoices or business cards include in the items. As far I can tell you the ratio is 1 Invoice in 5 buys.

quote:

Originally posted by kane1:

As a buyer. Seriously, every year I see less and less Invoices or business cards include in the items. As far I can tell you the ratio is 1 Invoice in 5 buys.

I don't put invoices in with my cards any more in an effort to save ink/paper (which is better for the environment and my wallet).
But if a buyer requests an invoice, I will include one.