quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
A faded Susan Sarandon Topps Bull Durham card sold last month for $782

PSA 9

Dang. I forgot about these. Seems like a lot of the signatures on these cards have faded, or seeped in to the surface or something.

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
A faded Susan Sarandon Topps Bull Durham card sold last month for $782

PSA 9

I find that very telling about the state of grading and what people think they are buying. I can't find that sale, but a faded signature on a certified autograph card is NEVER worth a 9 grade. The signature is one of the most important, if not THE most important, parts of a certified autograph card. Its why you are buying it.

I can only think that PSA graded for overall card condition and ignored the autograph because it wasn't paid to authenticate or evaluate it. If they said that the autograph was considered and it is obviously fading to the naked eye, and it still got a 9, then the grade is a crock altogether.

Here it is:



I think I'm one of the few people who thought BULL DURHAM was a lousy movie.

I didn't like Bull Durham at all.

The PSA label correctly identifies the card as Bull Durham autograph, but there is zippo mention of an autograph quality evaluation or rating. It's a bit difficult to tell if that signature suffers from streaking, fading, bleeding at the edges, or a combination, but it is not a mint autograph or a 9. If the card condition is deemed to be a 9, that autograph should result in a further reduction or should be graded separately on the PSA label.

That would be how this amateur grader would see it. Overall the best for me would be 7.0 and I would expect that card to be discounted when sold and not go near $700 when the auto is damaged.

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
A faded Susan Sarandon Topps Bull Durham card sold last month for $782

PSA 9

I find that very telling about the state of grading and what people think they are buying. I can't find that sale, but a faded signature on a certified autograph card is NEVER worth a 9 grade. The signature is one of the most important, if not THE most important, parts of a certified autograph card. Its why you are buying it.

I can only think that PSA graded for overall card condition and ignored the autograph because it wasn't paid to authenticate or evaluate it. If they said that the autograph was considered and it is obviously fading to the naked eye, and it still got a 9, then the grade is a crock altogether.

PSA only grades the card and ignores the autograph, unless you pay them an extra fee and then they grade both. For years PSA only graded the card, but a few years ago they started giving submitters the option to have both graded for an extra charge. I'm assuming that was in direct response to Beckett's dominance at the time in autograph card grading. Beckett has always been the go-to company for autograph grading because they graded the autograph as well as the card. I'm not sure if PSA has gained ground in that regard recently but it seems like Beckett is still the preferred choice for autograph card grading (for the most part).

... and just to add, Beckett's fee to grade the autograph itself is only $2 (and I don't think it's optional), whereas I believe PSA's fee is much higher.

quote:

Originally posted by Logan:

PSA only grades the card and ignores the autograph, unless you pay them an extra fee and then they grade both.

Precisely. Now do you think the buyer of that Sarandon card knows it, or do they think they have a Mint 9 example for their money?

There was definitely something wrong with the pens used for this set as nearly everyone signing seemed to have this problem. Some cards ended up worse than others. Even the clean signatures have a lighter or faded quality to them.

There was nothing deceiving or misleading about the auction. You can see the card clearly and anyone spending nearly $800 on a card who doesn't do their homework deserves what they end up with.

I doubt that was the case as the Costner and Sarandon cards from this set are getting more difficult to find.

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

There was nothing deceiving or misleading about the auction.

No, I am not implying deceit, just that the grading process is flawed and the grading of certified autograph cards has a loophole big enough to drive a truck through. You should not have to choose an option when there is an autograph. The quality of the signature is key. Authentication even more so, but a genuine certified autograph card is guaranteed in the process, so a fourth party authentication is not necessary.

Everyone should understand, if they don't know it already, that condition grading does not consider the autograph and a damaged signature will not result in a reduction, as it certainly should.

Admittedly I am not a big Buffy card expert. Can anyone explain this other than a charity gone wild?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Buffy...rksid=p2047675.l2557

Ok, I am definitely not selling correctly!!!

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Angel...rksid=p2047675.l2557

In auctions like these where the price is just daft i wonder if the seller ever gets paid.

quote:

Originally posted by wolfie:
In auctions like these where the price is just daft i wonder if the seller ever gets paid.

After looking at them again, I am pretty sure these are just people tossing money at the charity.

Here are some recent auctions I have dug up.


Ryan Reynolds $699.99 BIN with best offer, sold for $600
Two dual Shatner/Nimoy cards sold on a BIN $625 each
Shatner A50 BIN $482.49 with best offer, sold for $412.88
Richard Dean Anderson full name Stargate $420
SMG and Alison from RA's Buffy releases $344.77 each in March
Same SMG Series 3 sold in Feb with a bin $274.75 but sold for $200 another sold in Feb for $192.50 and oddly enough a couple have sold in March for under $200.
Hemsworth Star Trek 2009 $350 one sold in Jan for a BO of $120
Kristen Bell Heroes BIN $275.82
Patrick Macnee BSG $202.50
Spiderman JK Simmons costume/auto BIN $199.99 sold for $165.00 (wont be surprised to see this one go up)
Osbournes set of 4 had a BIN of $1000 sold for $480 in Feb. Given that Ozzy alone has been going for $500+ someone got a good deal.
Tom Hardy $217

Also, I have been crawling through my 2019 purchases and for the most part things are either close to what I paid for them or higher. In some cases significantly.

I paid $237 for the Willie Nelson Donruss cut numbered to 100. Been selling at $400+

Paid $46.58 for a RA George Lazenby that is now going for $120.

The 5 311 members from Goodwin has more than doubled.

I paid $289 for Americana Jacki Chan.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mykdude,

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

quote:

Originally posted by wolfie:
In auctions like these where the price is just daft i wonder if the seller ever gets paid.

After looking at them again, I am pretty sure these are just people tossing money at the charity.

No, Catholic Charities isn't selling Buffy demon cards and only a small portion of the sale is going as a donation to them according to the private seller. Something else is going on with those cards and I have no idea what, except to ignore it.

I appear to be on a roll lately agreeing with wolfie, but I do again, although I can't recall ever using the word daft. Just freaking nuts.

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:

I appear to be on a roll lately agreeing with wolfie, but I do again,

They all come round to my way of thinking in the end.

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

quote:

Originally posted by wolfie:
In auctions like these where the price is just daft i wonder if the seller ever gets paid.

After looking at them again, I am pretty sure these are just people tossing money at the charity.

No, Catholic Charities isn't selling Buffy demon cards and only a small portion of the sale is going as a donation to them according to the private seller. Something else is going on with those cards and I have no idea what, except to ignore it.

I appear to be on a roll lately agreeing with wolfie, but I do again, although I can't recall ever using the word daft. Just freaking nuts.

Hahaha! Hey! It's about the only excuse I could come up with. Especially seeing other auctions for the same card at a much cheaper price.

Read on one of them that the Robia LaMorte was considered hard to find. Does anyone remember that? I know she signed for other Buffy sets?

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
Admittedly I am not a big Buffy card expert. Can anyone explain this other than a charity gone wild?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Buffy...rksid=p2047675.l2557

I just realized I've noticed this seller's name popping up a lot in searches I have been doing.

A lot of the cards they are selling are inexpensive, so while there charity aspect may be bumping up a few cards it doesn't seem to be impacting most of their sales.

They have a number of in person signatures up for sale too that I'm not so sure about.

I have no idea why this particular card is so high.

The last sale for this card in PWCC was in 2018 for $75 -- perhaps a couple of people have just been looking for this card for a very long time.

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
It's about the only excuse I could come up with. Especially seeing other auctions for the same card at a much cheaper price.

Read on one of them that the Robia LaMorte was considered hard to find. Does anyone remember that? I know she signed for other Buffy sets?

It's hard to drill down on those two auctions, but here's what I would look at.

Neither card was graded, so no premiums there. Both cards were bought by the same person after multiple bids, so that could mean price was no object, a bidding war, or just anyone wanting them enough to overpay.

Both cards are from the respective Second seasons of Angel and Buffy. The almanac price for the Julie Benz A9 Angel is $80 and it sold for $300. The almanac price for the Robin LaMorte A8 Buffy is $100 and it sold for $811.

The LaMorte should be rarer, as there were only 5 autograph cards in Buffy Season 2. However the 3 other cards were higher priced, having been the Carpenter, Head and Ritter. Carpenter books the highest at $400. LaMorte appears to be out of show business and is now involved with Christian counseling.

Julie Benz is better known since she was in Dexter and is still acting, but Angel didn't have the demand of Buffy There were 9 autograph cards in that set and the Benz is priced behind Carpenter (again), Landau, and the dual of Benz/Landau, which listed the highest at $200.

Those prices were taken from the 2020 almanac and you could make the case that they have gone up. But that cards worth a high column of $180 in a guide should sell for $1,111 without grading is hard to understand, especially when we aren't talking about high demand celebrities.

I don't know if there are anymore auctions like this out there, haven't looked, but if you are mining eBay to come up with these sort of weird sales, you will probably find them. You just will never know if they were mistakes, overpayments, retractions or trojan horses.

I have seen inexplicable shootouts at the end of an auction before - an item that ordinarily would have gone for $20-40 ended up at $300 because for some reason two buyers had to have that one. Equally weird was the fact that another seller must have seen the action and put up another one for auction. It got no bids.