I know were off topic on this, but seeing as the topic is going here anyway, might as well post it here. Here are my thoughts on sketchs.

Artists 6 back sketch average 350 dollars each (that being low side generous, many get 600+ each, some 1000+ each)thats 2100 dollars for thoes alone. You also get 1.50 a sketch. most artists can easily turn out 100 sketchs in a week and put some time in (the kayanans of the world, no but they paint , and they are getting 1k+ each on the commissions, so they dont count here. Ive read a lot of blogs, and they seem to indicate doing 15 sketchs a day isnt overly hard (30 mins a sketch). So lets just think of this

Artist A.

1. Does 100 sketchs a week at 1.50 a sketch.
2. they work 2 weeks, make 200 sketch for $300
3. They do 6 great return sketchs at $2100 for that same 2 week period.
4. Pays 100-200 for supplies for sketchs
you get

300 (base sketchs)+2100 (6 back)-200(supplies)=
$2200 dollars for 2 weeks work.

If your getting 1100 a week to draw 7 hours a day...and you turn out sketchs that took almost as long to sign as it did to draw...then your not doing your job. for 1100 dollars a week, dear god, spend 15 mins on each sketch at least. If there is as much pencil in your signed name as on the sketch itself, your jobbing the fans. If you spent a good percentage of the time on each sketch signing your name versus drawing, then your jobbing the fans. If your doing 100+ of the same sketch over and over, and each one is taking under 3 mins, your jobbing the fans. If you cant commit to spending at least 10 mins on each sketch drawing, then honestly dont take the work. OR, if you do choose to do sketchs that take 2 mins or less each, Then fine just dont complain when fans point out how horrible your work is, and how cheated they feel to pull one of your sketchs out of their $50+ dollar box.

ok, but we are not talking about the people that do 100 cards. We are talking about Grant and Waterhouse that do 2000 cards. So by your math.

2000 cards = $2000
6 x $150 = $1350

divide that, and you come up with ----- wait for it ---- $1.67 a card.


People just need to stop complaining. Topps WON'T increase their pay....look at some of the garbage that came out of Marvel Masterpieces 07. Upper Deck got a good mix of great artists, but they also hired some lets say "unproven" artists to do sketches and they came out horribly. Why would Topps pay artists more when they can just go get some kid looking for work to help pay for art school to do some. All you have to do is submit a portfolio and Topps will at least consider you. So if you think you can do better, then make a portfolio and submit it and when Topps asks for 2000 cards from you then you can work for $1.67 a card and have two weeks to do them and we'll see how your final product comes out. Some people don't understand just how much some of the artists put into these sets.

Are you trying to tell me that at some point in your life, your boss asked you to do something and gave you a ridiculous deadline for it. You got it done, but it wasn't 100% to your liking. Topps are the artists boss. It is as simple as that. Why do you think Topps keeps coming back to people like Grant and Waterhouse for every set? It's because they know that they can produce large amounts of cards, in short periods of time that EASILY pass for SKETCHES.

Buying a box of cards is a gamble. Chances are, you won't make your money back... in Non Sports, or Sports boxes. I think the real complaint, whether people will admit it or not is that they won't make a $ back on their pulls. Obviously, if you do not like the art you are going to trade or sell it, and sketches like Grants and Waterhouses don't sell for big bucks (although some of Grants stuff goes crazy) because of how many repeats there are.

But I will stop with this, because there are always going to be people who do not appreciate what some artists are able to do with just a couple strokes of a brush, or in this case, a marker.



However, I do agree that so far what I have seen as far as the collation goes is pretty horrible. You should expect a Gould and Waterhouse is just about every case but getting repeats of lower numbered artists is uncalled for.


EDIT:

quote:

Originally posted by zhamlau:


Artist A.

1. Does 100 sketchs a week at 1.50 a sketch.
2. they work 2 weeks, make 200 sketch for $300
3. They do 6 great return sketchs at $2100 for that same 2 week period.
4. Pays 100-200 for supplies for sketchs
you get

300 (base sketchs)+2100 (6 back)-200(supplies)=
$2200 dollars for 2 weeks work.

We aren't talking about artist A. We are talking about artist B who does 2000 sketches.

Also, I don't know where the heck you got your average, because most artists charge closer to $200 for their returned 6 cards. I own about 20 different returned cards from numerous sets and I think the most I have paid for one was $300.


Also, if an artist who does 2000 sketches were to spend 10 minutes on every sketch and had two weeks to do them, they would spend 13.88 days doing them. I guess 3/25 of a day is enough to eat, sleep, and do everything else they need to in those two weeks.

Ok. This topic doesn't belong in here. I'm starting a new topic in general discussion.
I believe this topic has merit (we do spend LOTS of money on this stuff), but I think the box breakdown area is not the best place. My apologies to all.

Join me in general discussion to continue this debate!

Does anybody know where I can find a website with the gallery of the sketch of every single artist?

OK...here we go....I opened 12 boxes and pulled the stated 2 sketches per box....I was also able to purchase 8 sketches from a fairly unhappy guy who busted a case and was giving the local shop owner a bit of hell...anyway, made a joke offer and the guy took it....so here are 32 total sketches...roughly 2 cases worth:

Ill continue this in the box breakdown thread here with ya bryan.
continued here

quote:

Originally posted by tlca:
Does anybody know where I can find a website with the gallery of the sketch of every single artist?

Here you go ,

LOTRsketchcards.com

You know what? Out of those 32 sketches there are only about 6 or so that I'd actually be really disappointed pulling out of a box. The rest are either kind of ok, pretty neat, or awesome.

I would gladly make the tradeoff to get multiple Pernas along with any other artist! Also, congrats on the Soni...that is the first of hers that I have seen.

Thanks....she does good work...alot of detail, especially as compared to the bulk guys like Woodside, Gould, and Waterhouse. Just to compare, I wonder how many each did.

quote:

Originally posted by JeffG:
Thanks....she does good work...alot of detail, especially as compared to the bulk guys like Woodside, Gould, and Waterhouse. Just to compare, I wonder how many each did.

Soni did 159, Woodside 1306, Gould 2006, I haven't seen any numbers for Waterhouse.

Just to compare, Fabbri did 2500 for masterpieces one, and each sketch was indeed a mini masterpiece. I guess he spoiled us. Just because an artist does over over 1000 sketches, doesn't mean it should be sloppy.

Wow, 3 Perna sketch cards and a Soni !!!! Wow . Makes up for the Waterhouse cards. I think the big stink is over Waterhouse's cards because they lack variation. Grant Gould atleast splashes a little color here and there and changes facial expressions. He goes the extra way to make em different

I have read all the comments this far and then went back and re-read the LOTR MP1 breakdown thread and it is like deja vu all over again! Yes with a release this big and 2 sketches per box there is going to be some filler. It's expected and OK. The cases are well balanced and I feel I got my money's worth from each and every case.

Thanks goes out to all the artists and your great work on this set

Back to breakdowns...I have scanned 4 of my 6 cases so far and am pleased overall.

Case 1

Case 2

Case 3

Case 4

Very nice! I would be thrilled with case breaks like that (do you hear that, unopened cases?)

Is this part of a multi-panel? I'm not sure what it is.

The sketches in this release to be a real mixed bag. I'm glad to see that on this page the majority of sketches look really good with about 10% to 15% being exceptional.
I really enjoyed the base set & foil cards in the first release and have ordered 2 boxes only to get two extra sketches. It's a bit of a gamble I suppose, but not as expensive a one as a bad case.

Thanks to those who have posted their breakdowns - it's great seeing them.