quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
Additionally, the Shadowbox cards, at basically one set per case, should garner a nice price for case breakers while being aesthetically pleasing to card collectors at the same time. The same can be said for the parallel sets. Single box breakers won't be able to make one. They'll need to go to case breakers to acquire such a set. To wit, dealers will have options other than only autograph cards with which to recoup their costs and realize a profit.

Except if/when the big case breakers (we all know the usual suspects) start off selling everything dirt cheap.

We all thought that the Marvel shadowboxes would have done well but the large sellers started a pricing trend and the set can be had for $35+shipping. The parallels will follow suit at about $25-$35 a set. Considering that only get 1 parallel set per case and 2/3 of a shadowbox set per case, both should be at least double.

It certainly looks like RA put a fine set together, but I most likely be watching from the sidelines on this one.

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
Additionally, the Shadowbox cards, at basically one set per case, should garner a nice price for case breakers while being aesthetically pleasing to card collectors at the same time. The same can be said for the parallel sets. Single box breakers won't be able to make one. They'll need to go to case breakers to acquire such a set. To wit, dealers will have options other than only autograph cards with which to recoup their costs and realize a profit.

Except if/when the big case breakers (we all know the usual suspects) start off selling everything dirt cheap.

We all thought that the Marvel shadowboxes would have done well but the large sellers started a pricing trend and the set can be had for $35+shipping. The parallels will follow suit at about $25-$35 a set. Considering that only get 1 parallel set per case and 2/3 of a shadowbox set per case, both should be at least double.

It certainly looks like RA put a fine set together, but I most likely be watching from the sidelines on this one.

Gee heres a thought quit buying cards just trying to make money off them!

I use to be a case breaker until I saw it was much cheaper at the auction sites. I'm also not commited if after release I don't like the cards.

quote:

Originally posted by watchers of watchers:

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
Additionally, the Shadowbox cards, at basically one set per case, should garner a nice price for case breakers while being aesthetically pleasing to card collectors at the same time. The same can be said for the parallel sets. Single box breakers won't be able to make one. They'll need to go to case breakers to acquire such a set. To wit, dealers will have options other than only autograph cards with which to recoup their costs and realize a profit.

Except if/when the big case breakers (we all know the usual suspects) start off selling everything dirt cheap.

We all thought that the Marvel shadowboxes would have done well but the large sellers started a pricing trend and the set can be had for $35+shipping. The parallels will follow suit at about $25-$35 a set. Considering that only get 1 parallel set per case and 2/3 of a shadowbox set per case, both should be at least double.

It certainly looks like RA put a fine set together, but I most likely be watching from the sidelines on this one.

Gee heres a thought quit buying cards just trying to make money off them!

That's pretty harsh. What's wrong with being a dealer? Someone has to break cases.

If all the dealers stopped selling cards tomorrow, your only option would be direct at $84 dollars a box. Wouldn't that be fun?

Ed

quote:

Originally posted by Scifi Cards:

That's pretty harsh. What's wrong with being a dealer? Someone has to break cases.

If all the dealers stopped selling cards tomorrow, your only option would be direct at $84 dollars a box. Wouldn't that be fun?

Ed

Exactly why I quite like having at least some of the autos as dealer incentives. If they were only available in boxes, there wouldn't be any way of buying them (because the collector would keep them) and having decent dealer incentives makes it cheaper to buy boxes because the dealer has other ways of making money. Of course, I prefer it when the same cards are also included in boxes so there's some chance of pulling one.

I find dealer incentives actually more accessible than reward cards.

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
Additionally, the Shadowbox cards, at basically one set per case, should garner a nice price for case breakers while being aesthetically pleasing to card collectors at the same time. The same can be said for the parallel sets. Single box breakers won't be able to make one. They'll need to go to case breakers to acquire such a set. To wit, dealers will have options other than only autograph cards with which to recoup their costs and realize a profit.

Except if/when the big case breakers (we all know the usual suspects) start off selling everything dirt cheap.

We all thought that the Marvel shadowboxes would have done well but the large sellers started a pricing trend and the set can be had for $35+shipping. The parallels will follow suit at about $25-$35 a set. Considering that only get 1 parallel set per case and 2/3 of a shadowbox set per case, both should be at least double.

I see your overall point, but I don't think these Game of Thrones cards can be compared to Marvel cards even though we are discussing the same type of inserts, the reason being that there is a new Marvel set every other month these days, way too many for the market to bear. Sketch cards in particular, are way too abundant, resulting in some manufacturers' need to use artists who have no business drawing them, which leads to many sketch driven products being dumped when too many consumers decide to not risk $60 on a box that could well leave them only with a lousy sketch card and worse, a base set that was an afterthought since with the sketches being the main draw of so many of these products, oftentimes very little effort goes into the creation of the base sets. Understandable I guess, if your mind-set is that base cards are essentially a disposable extension of the pack wrappers, just more stuff packed around the all-important sketch card.

As awesome as Rittenhouse is in the overall, they have been among the worst offenders in this way in the past. For instance, "The Batman Archives" base set simply should not exist. It was a seemingly arbitrary selection of comic covers with no copy on the card reverse (but the exact same image as on the front!) and not even artists' credits. The new Upper Deck Marvel Masterpieces sets will not age well either, particularly series 2 or 3, as they were dreadful, with art selection done by someone who I don't think had ever even looked at a comic book. Upper Deck has turned it around with their recent "Marvel Beginnings" base set, which is awesome, and worthy of the glory years of Fleer/Skybox, the first modern Marvel set I would say that about.

Indeed, the production of this many Marvel related sets happened once before, in the years 1994 through 1997, and Fleer/Skybox collapsed soon after, even though the sets were actually getting better and better and had, towards the end, even added such novel innovations (for super-heroes sets) such as autographs and sketches. (I should say that I don't know that's why Fleer/Skybox eventually went under. They'd been overproducing sports cards for years as well, and that couldn't have helped either).

Back to the point, with the Game of Thrones, there is only one set to be had, and it'll be a least another year before the followup is issued. The market won't be (over)saturated with the GoT cards as it is currently with Marvel cards and the parallel and shadowbox cards from Game of Thrones should therefore hold a greater value than any modern Marvel insert set.

There should only be a total of 500 Shadowbox sets, and even less of the parallel sets as they can never all be put back together once they have been spread out, which happens every time someone buys a single box as opposed to breaking a case.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: chesspieceface,

I've been collecting all sorts of cards nearly my entire life, sports and non-sports alike and this is the first product I am seriously considering buying a case of.

Would have liked to have got a case of TWD, but could only afford a couple boxes at the time.

If I have to, I may take out a loan to get one of these. As for the autos I don't acquire from a case, I'll just have to take my chances on a certain online auction site, or do some trading.

Okay, I've never collected anything marvel, or anything that includes them before so I have no idea what they are. Can someone explain what these shadow box cards are please?

It's a big card with 3 layers - background, Character and Plastic top - sort of 3D effect

Thanks, I didn't know what a shadow box card was either

Thanks Hammer, they sound interesting. So when you say big, do you mean the size of the card or are they just really thick like some costume cards.

Are we sure it's limited to 6000 boxes/500 cases? I was trying to find confirmation of that and couldn't. Unless that's just standard for Rittenhouse; I've never collected cards from them before.

And what's the cheapest place to order a case? The cheapest I've found so far is $650 plus shipping.

quote:

Originally posted by ctacker:
Are we sure it's limited to 6000 boxes/500 cases? I was trying to find confirmation of that and couldn't. Unless that's just standard for Rittenhouse; I've never collected cards from them before.

And what's the cheapest place to order a case? The cheapest I've found so far is $650 plus shipping.

I dont know where I heard that from, but I think its pretty standard for a Rittenhouse TV show

quote:

Originally posted by watchers of watchers:

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
Additionally, the Shadowbox cards, at basically one set per case, should garner a nice price for case breakers while being aesthetically pleasing to card collectors at the same time. The same can be said for the parallel sets. Single box breakers won't be able to make one. They'll need to go to case breakers to acquire such a set. To wit, dealers will have options other than only autograph cards with which to recoup their costs and realize a profit.

Except if/when the big case breakers (we all know the usual suspects) start off selling everything dirt cheap.

We all thought that the Marvel shadowboxes would have done well but the large sellers started a pricing trend and the set can be had for $35+shipping. The parallels will follow suit at about $25-$35 a set. Considering that only get 1 parallel set per case and 2/3 of a shadowbox set per case, both should be at least double.

It certainly looks like RA put a fine set together, but I most likely be watching from the sidelines on this one.

Gee heres a thought quit buying cards just trying to make money off them!

Gee here is another thought...keep your rude comments about MY business to yourself.

As Ed mentioned earlier, SOMEONE needs to open product so that the masses can purchase what they want. As a dealer, I provide options for those collectors who do not want to open up tons of wax to suit their needs. My only problem is with some of the largest dealers who kill the market for the product by setting low BIN's on the first day of release (or in some seller's case...BEFORE release date).

Chesspieceface, I was only comparing the shadowbox cards from Marvel because they are the only other set to have them so far. Look at every Bond and Star Trek release and you will see the same problem with autos.

I found these photos online taken at the philly show of all the Game of Thrones autographs.

[img]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7039/7116227787_eb17b99c98_z.jpg"> [/IMG]


GAME OF THRONES PHOTO 2 by bigmike2738, on Flickr

quote:

7116227787

GAME OF THRONES PHOTO 1 by bigmike2738, on Flickr

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by watchers of watchers:

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by chesspieceface:
Additionally, the Shadowbox cards, at basically one set per case, should garner a nice price for case breakers while being aesthetically pleasing to card collectors at the same time. The same can be said for the parallel sets. Single box breakers won't be able to make one. They'll need to go to case breakers to acquire such a set. To wit, dealers will have options other than only autograph cards with which to recoup their costs and realize a profit.

Except if/when the big case breakers (we all know the usual suspects) start off selling everything dirt cheap.

We all thought that the Marvel shadowboxes would have done well but the large sellers started a pricing trend and the set can be had for $35+shipping. The parallels will follow suit at about $25-$35 a set. Considering that only get 1 parallel set per case and 2/3 of a shadowbox set per case, both should be at least double.

It certainly looks like RA put a fine set together, but I most likely be watching from the sidelines on this one.

Gee heres a thought quit buying cards just trying to make money off them!

Gee here is another thought...keep your rude comments about MY business to yourself.

As Ed mentioned earlier, SOMEONE needs to open product so that the masses can purchase what they want. As a dealer, I provide options for those collectors who do not want to open up tons of wax to suit their needs. My only problem is with some of the largest dealers who kill the market for the product by setting low BIN's on the first day of release (or in some seller's case...BEFORE release date).

Chesspieceface, I was only comparing the shadowbox cards from Marvel because they are the only other set to have them so far. Look at every Bond and Star Trek release and you will see the same problem with autos.

Unfortunately this isn't a new debate and it's one that pops up on this board on a fairly regular basis.

With money being as tight as it is a large number of collectors will take the view that they aren't worried about the whole food chain, but only where they can get the lowest price for the cards they want.

As for your comments on the Bond and Trek products that's a very sad truth indeed. If anyone doubts this all they need do is look a ebay and you'll see plenty of these lower tier autos selling for well under $10 on a daily basis.

My only beef with this product is that autographs were used as the incentives and from the two biggest stars of the show. Considering what appears to be some awesome cooperation from HBO to put this product on the street I find it hard to believe to couldn't sacrifice one measley flag or pennant for RA to chop-up or that a small handful of artists wouldn't give their eye teeth to do 5-10 sketches each for this set to be used as incentives.

I'm sorry, but in this case I'll more than likely join the masses and opt for buying someone dumping some pre packaged offering.

quote:

Originally posted by Arvin Sloane:

Unfortunately this isn't a new debate and it's one that pops up on this board on a fairly regular basis.

With money being as tight as it is a large number of collectors will take the view that they aren't worried about the whole food chain, but only where they can get the lowest price for the cards they want.

As for your comments on the Bond and Trek products that's a very sad truth indeed. If anyone doubts this all they need do is look a ebay and you'll see plenty of these lower tier autos selling for well under $10 on a daily basis.

My only beef with this product is that autographs were used as the incentives and from the two biggest stars of the show. Considering what appears to be some awesome cooperation from HBO to put this product on the street I find it hard to believe to couldn't sacrifice one measley flag or pennant for RA to chop-up or that a small handful of artists wouldn't give their eye teeth to do 5-10 sketches each for this set to be used as incentives.

I'm sorry, but in this case I'll more than likely join the masses and opt for buying someone dumping some pre packaged offering.

Trust me, I am all too aware of the long standing (and silly) opinion of some folks that dealers do nothing but take money from the sets. I just felt the need to react when someone calls out my place in the industry. I like to think that us "small dealers" tend do right by the hobby.

As to your (our) point on the Bond/Trek autos, the common autos from many of these sets end up collecting dust in my $3 bin at shows. Even the VL/XL cards get pieced off quick and low which is the real killer.

Back on topic, I really do wish nothing but the best for those ripping this product.

quote:

Originally posted by MarvelMorris:

quote:

7116227787

GAME OF THRONES PHOTO 1 by bigmike2738, on Flickr

NICE! Thanks for sharing! The shadowbox cards look similar to the SPX Football inserts. I love em! Very premium insert cards! I still can't believe this autograph line up!

quote:

Originally posted by igman7:

quote:

Originally posted by Arvin Sloane:

Unfortunately this isn't a new debate and it's one that pops up on this board on a fairly regular basis.

With money being as tight as it is a large number of collectors will take the view that they aren't worried about the whole food chain, but only where they can get the lowest price for the cards they want.

As for your comments on the Bond and Trek products that's a very sad truth indeed. If anyone doubts this all they need do is look a ebay and you'll see plenty of these lower tier autos selling for well under $10 on a daily basis.

My only beef with this product is that autographs were used as the incentives and from the two biggest stars of the show. Considering what appears to be some awesome cooperation from HBO to put this product on the street I find it hard to believe to couldn't sacrifice one measley flag or pennant for RA to chop-up or that a small handful of artists wouldn't give their eye teeth to do 5-10 sketches each for this set to be used as incentives.

I'm sorry, but in this case I'll more than likely join the masses and opt for buying someone dumping some pre packaged offering.

I like to think that us "small dealers" tend do right by the hobby.

Hear, hear!
I am very grateful to case breakers big and small. They provide access to many cards that people (myself often included) who can only open a box or two wouldn't otherwise have a chance at. Case breakers are undoubtedly instrumental in some sets even being issued in the first place. Rittenhouse and Breygent, I would think, are especially pre-order driven. A product that a large percentage of is already sold before it is even printed likely helps a smaller company to eliminate the kind of risks that eventually brought Inkworks down. Smaller companies can't absorb unsuccessful sets in the way that Topps and Upper Deck can, who also have sports cards and other products to bail them out.

One thing for sure is that our non-sports hobby needs everyone it can opening as many packs as possible, and spreading the hobby in any way you can, besides.

I have a somewhat unusual perspective on this. While I am definitely not a dealer by vocation, I realized long ago I can buy A LOT more cards if I'm willing to sell some of them off, so I've been a de facto dealer in some cases. It's often a lot of work, and sometimes feels like a business, but the chance to open up a case of something I like instead of just a box or two is often irresistable. There is always risk involved, but it is mitigated by the fact that I know I'll get some of the money back. I don't hope to make a profit on case purchase, just to end up with a nice selection of cards. Indeed, both of those things usually do happen: I make no profit, but end up with a nice batch of "keepers" for my collection.

Case breakers must know bynow that it is pretty tough to make a profit from Rittenhouse Archives cards if you're opening the packs and selling what you find inside. You would be better off selling sealed boxes, I think, especially if you can hold off on selling them until they have largely sold out elsewhere. Eventually, pretty much all of them do, thanks to the finite print run. And thanks to Rittenhouse having never once used a redemption card, there is no risk of ending up with unusable redemption cards in any sealed boxes you hold on to.

In my view, Rittenhouse is really designed for the collector who is in it for the long haul, and not a flipper of opened product. Topps and Upper Deck tend to be a safer choice for that. And that's not to say Rittenhouse cards aren't or won't continue to be valuable. If cards are still collected 50 years from now, this first decade-plus of Rittenhouse cards will be considered a high point in the hobby, I have no doubt, and their cards will be among the most highly prized of all.

I sure like the ones I have now!

Good luck to everyone buying this Games of Thrones, and thanks MarvelMorris, for the awesome picture of the autographs.