Base set collectors should love this. . . it's actually going to be something that you can collect and trade for, vs cracking a box and winding up with 3 sets. . .

I love the idea of far fewer base cards. . . I do wish these were standard size, but I'm sure the cards will be great.

Jon

quote:

Originally posted by jon@webjon.com:
Base set collectors should love this. . . it's actually going to be something that you can collect and trade for, vs cracking a box and winding up with 3 sets. . .

I love the idea of far fewer base cards. . . I do wish these were standard size, but I'm sure the cards will be great.

I'm actually finding it to be quite the opposite. I've had 4 cancelations since it was confirmed this is a pack product (and you need 14 packs to have enough cards to trade into a base set).

Turns out the casual collector is just skipping it entirely, or so it seems.

Wish I could be more positive but I'm just reporting what my customers have done. Most of them are monster fans and would actually like the base set more than the 14 sketches you'll have getting to the base set. And these aren't people who are interested in flipping the sketches on eBay, two of them don't even have computers.

I LOVE this seriese and will probably troll around and try to put together a base set (maybe some for customers too). I like the large format, it's great for poster details. And I loved the Metallogloss cards in the Cartoon Sketch Art set, so double sized ones will be cool too.

Ed

quote:

Originally posted by beamer:
Why don't we all wait and see when the product is released. It makes no sense to throw Breygent "under the bus" without giving the product a chance. Maybe once you see what comes in each pack, you may feel differently. And as for the MSRP, no one has any idea how much a pack will cost yet. Why guess. Let's just wait and see. I am sure when dealers start breaking packs down you will be able to pick up a set and the chase at a fairly reasonable price.

Mike,

I don't think we are throwing Breygent under the bus, just voiceing opinions that are different from you.

Yes, I do know exactly what these will cost so that ones not correct.

And we do know what's in these packs, Tom's told us. 4 Base Cards, 2 Chase, a Metallogloss, and a Sketch, with autos randomly inserted.

Now, I have AT LEAST 4 customers who want a base set. That means, as a dealer I would need 49 packs to have enough base cards to make those sets, if collation were perfect. That's over $1500 retail to try to make 4 base sets.

Yes, I'd have 49 sketches, the chase, and the Metallogloss cards to sell as well. But I truely believe that the sketch market is saturated and being oversized will hurt the appeal of these (just like widevision sketches are not as popular).

I think this has been a fair discussion of the facts. Nobody's under the bus.

Ed

I applaud Tom for trying something different, It is an experiment worth trying. I like the bigger cards for the poster sets as you get a better image on the card. I would actually like to see more sets done with bigger cards.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: hammer,

More than anything i want a binder and base set for this release so i hope the price is reasonable when all the packs have been broken. For the time being i will take Tom's advice and calm down.

personally i can not wait for this set or the woodstock set and like i said in my earlyer post this pack format give value to the base set. unlike many other sets where you can pick up a base set for a couple of bucks, and dont forget its "green" not haveing 50,000 base sets floating around : )

quote:

Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
Now, I have AT LEAST 4 customers who want a base set. That means, as a dealer I would need 49 packs to have enough base cards to make those sets, if collation were perfect. That's over $1500 retail to try to make 4 base sets.

This format is a different way of thinking, and there definitely will be a period of adjustment. . . I can understand set collectors not buying packs of this product. . . I would hope they turn into set collectors who hunt these cards down for a buck a piece or whatever at a card show.

I would hope this type of set spurs more trading, and 'dealing'. . . instead of picking up $1500 worth of product to rip and flip, perhaps dealers will pick up their normal amount -- sell it to sketch collectors, then buy or trade for the base cards they need to make sets for their customers. . . Hopefully this will be the case one day. . . Because currently the base set is a huge cost to manufacturers that doesn't add a lot of value to a box.

Jon

Ed, I know what the packs cost too. And I also know whether or not a product comes out in box or pack form, there will be inexpensive sets. Dealers will order $1,500 worth of packs and rip and flip them. They will make profit on the sketches and the rest will sell for whatever the market warrants. For some reason, you seem to have more negative comments than you do positive. How about trying to support the hobby and not chastise it. Maybe you had cancellations because people found someone else selling it for less...
You know anything is possible.

quote:

Originally posted by beamer:
Ed, I know what the packs cost too. And I also know whether or not a product comes out in box or pack form, there will be inexpensive sets. Dealers will order $1,500 worth of packs and rip and flip them. They will make profit on the sketches and the rest will sell for whatever the market warrants. For some reason, you seem to have more negative comments than you do positive. How about trying to support the hobby and not chastise it. Maybe you had cancellations because people found someone else selling it for less...
You know anything is possible.

Mike, this is starting to get personal and that's not the point at all.

If you knew what the packs cost (and I know why you would know) then why say nobody knows what the price will be?

Customers and posters on this board do not need "Yes Men" who will say that every product is the best thing ever. And that's not me either.

I absoultely loved the first set, as did many of my customers. And I think it's important that some of those customers are turned off by the new format. Feedback like this helps manufacturers if they listen, not hurt them.

If you want to continue to get personal, I'm not that hard to find via email...

Ed

quote:

Originally posted by beamer:

How about trying to support the hobby and not chastise it.

I can't believe you said that, Ed supports this hobby day in day out as a dealer, buying product and supporting the shows. If you need a target for your comments i suggest you look elsewhere.

TO ALL -

Let's not start attacking people personally just because I posted my opinion on this new format of releasing a set of cards. Voicing an opinion or theory on a product that hasn't been released yet is one thing, attacking a post is another. I'm quite sure Tom is not out to gouge the collector, and I'm also sure the product will be high quality. After all the packs are ripped open, and the dust settles, the sets, sketches, autos, and chase cards will be listed online, and then (and only then) we will see if getting a set of base cards will be affordable or not. The market can be fickle. (Who knew a box of Inkworks Twilight cards would skyrocket to where they are now?)

I apologize if my post created any undue panic.

For now, I'm taking a "wait and see" stance.

Maybe a solution for the future could be to have some boxes for the base-set builders along with the one-sketch-per-pack orders, kind of like how some sets have hobby and retail versions. I don't know how feasible that is in terms of manufacturing/packaging costs, but it's a thought.

quote:

Originally posted by Natalie:
Maybe a solution for the future could be to have some boxes for the base-set builders along with the one-sketch-per-pack orders, kind of like how some sets have hobby and retail versions. I don't know how feasible that is in terms of manufacturing/packaging costs, but it's a thought.

I believe we need to move away from a couple $'s Base Sets, if dealers are going to the trouble of purchasing large amounts of a product they don't want to have to rely on one part of a product to make a return on the investment.

Base sets have lost the appeal they once had and the approach Tom has taken may re-ignite the Base Set culture.

quote:

Originally posted by Natalie:
Maybe a solution for the future could be to have some boxes for the base-set builders along with the one-sketch-per-pack orders, kind of like how some sets have hobby and retail versions. I don't know how feasible that is in terms of manufacturing/packaging costs, but it's a thought.

Actually, it just occured to me there's already a model for this type of product: CCG Gaming.

CCG's normally have a starter that has all the basic stuff you need to get started. Then you buy boosters which have the "better" cards in the uncommons and rares.

I wouldn't be opposed to stocking 2 products, and it would still keep the number of base cards to a reasonable level.

Good thinking!

Ed

quote:

Originally posted by treksearcher:

quote:

Originally posted by Natalie:
Maybe a solution for the future could be to have some boxes for the base-set builders along with the one-sketch-per-pack orders, kind of like how some sets have hobby and retail versions. I don't know how feasible that is in terms of manufacturing/packaging costs, but it's a thought.

I believe we need to move away from a couple $'s Base Sets, if dealers are going to the trouble of purchasing large amounts of a product they don't want to have to rely on one part of a product to make a return on the investment.

Base sets have lost the appeal they once had and the approach Tom has taken may re-ignite the Base Set culture.

i agree with you especially when the base sets have all original art work on them, the base sets need more credit and a price tag to match, if two products were made i would like to see some deference between the rarer base cards verse the set per box cards if that makes any sense or there could be a little more base cards in each pack. i for one am really looking forward to the scifi set and woodstock, i will be trying to make at least one full set of base cards and Metallogloss cards so i will be looking for other collectors to trade with the set is released.

I prefer this method of product releases and to me Breygent can pretty much do what they want and it is Good as Gold! I understand the base cards are the meat of the hobby which is ok because I don't do Base cards so I really like this format even more!

quote:

Originally posted by Flag City Collectibles:

I don't do Base cards

Please send all base cards to Wolfie, care of the cave, UK.

quote:

Originally posted by Flag City Collectibles:
Breygent can pretty much do what they want and it is Good as Gold

Really? That's a pretty broad statement. I hope one day Breygent doesn't decide it wants all of its cards back, and goes to your place first to get them. You DID say "do whatever they want", right?

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Bill Hinzman

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