quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
So is Zerocool Fanatics non sport face or will they eventually move to the front?

That's a question that I don't think Fanatics has answered, despite a few press releases and articles. I'm sure they don't want to be pinned down. Zerocool is their brand for releasing their pop culture and entertainment cards. In other words, non-sport. But is it all non-sport? I really haven't seen any comments specific to the TOPPS titles. Will they have the TOPPS name on them? Will they say Zerocool or be subject to these new Zerocool distribution system procedures? Will retail and wholesale be merged in these Dutch auctions? Will some non-sport titles remain traditional as hobby boxes and retail? I also have no idea what they are doing on the sports card end at all.

So to answer the question, I think we may have to wait to find out on a product-by-product basis, at least for the rest of the year, until we know what they intend to do.

The people that they had at their booth could not exactly answer the question about if they are the exclusive entertainment department for Topps/Fanatics. They said that they were more focused on entertainment and that they were under the umbrella of Topps/Fanatics, that was it.

Also asked if they were planning on making the upcoming release direct release via dutch auction and they did not know.

Tried to get some of the promo packs but people were in line right at opening and the allotment for the day I was there was gone in less than 2 hours.

Full release announced...looks like Joseph Quinn went back to his normal autograph for the set.

https://www.beckett.com/news/2...ngs-4-trading-cards/

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
Full release announced...looks like Joseph Quinn went back to his normal autograph for the set.

https://www.beckett.com/news/2...ngs-4-trading-cards/

That's his complete signature on the card shown, but it doesn't mean that they are all like that. Checking his GoT autograph cards, he is pretty inconsistent. Some have his complete readable signatures, some have unreadable sloppy signatures, and some look like he wrote just his initials. Not good when some signers hand out varying quality for the same cost.

Those GoT autographs were on-card and these look-like stickers, which generally result in worse autographs. That could also be a mock up of his dual signature card just for promotion. We won't know how he signed until enough of his cards are actually pulled.

Is this going to be a regular hobby box release from ZeroCool for once?

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:

That's his complete signature on the card shown, but it doesn't mean that they are all like that. Checking his GoT autograph cards, he is pretty inconsistent.

I was referring to the "J" and a squiggle line he has been signing at conventions. When I met him I brought my GoT card and asked him if he could sign my custom in the same manner, which he did.

However as you said, when I checked out the same info on cardboard connection it mentioned that all images were mock ups.

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:
Is this going to be a regular hobby box release from ZeroCool for once?

It would appear so, box prices are being quoted at roughly $140 but nothing so far on insert ratios.

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

However as you said, when I checked out the same info on cardboard connection it mentioned that all images were mock ups.

I believe many mock-ups use autographs from their contracts. I know Bowman baseball cards did that for many years on their base cards.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

However as you said, when I checked out the same info on cardboard connection it mentioned that all images were mock ups.

I believe many mock-ups use autographs from their contracts. I know Bowman baseball cards did that for many years on their base cards.

Yeah, that makes sense. Of course there are those who have their fan signature which can differ from their legal document signature.

I think many convention goers weren't overly thrilled with Joseph's new streamline version.

https://www.cardboardconnectio...post_anchor_2_414552

And it gets weirder.....these dropped yesterday and can be purchased for $50 a box (24 cards) on Topps.

Looks like streamline Joseph is here to stay.

No checklist, no odds and obviously not part of the projected season 4 release.

Purchase link for those who are interested.

https://www.topps.com/cards-co...s-fright-flicks.html

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:
And it gets weirder.....these dropped yesterday and can be purchased for $50 a box (24 cards) on Topps.

Looks like streamline Joseph is here to stay.

No checklist, no odds and obviously not part of the projected season 4 release.

First of all, that Quinn signature is way worse than the worst of his bad GoT signatures. It's a nothing at all. So sad to see people who, with a bit of success, become so far removed from their own audience that they have no respect for those fans who might want their autograph as a keepsake.

Secondly, anything is possible with ZeroCool. It may still say Topps, but they aren't bound to follow any of the old hobby rules. Some people working in the industry and selling trading cards have their own theories about ZeroCool's intentions down the road. I won't repeat them here because they are opinions and rumors and some will no doubt be wrong or made up, but some make sense. Some sound possible.

There is as they say, a method to their madness, and they are trying to find the right balance of madness. All of this stuff is an experiment for them and some of it hasn't worked, but we are the market and the decider. ZeroCool may or may not have its heart set on something, but cards are not essentials and selling them as alternative investments, as other alternative investments become very shaky, is beginning to lose its talking point. As it should. You need a solid base of card collectors to sell cards. Without that there is no demand, and the prices will be forever stuck at retail until it all gets discounted.

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:
First of all, that Quinn signature is way worse than the worst of his bad GoT signatures. It's a nothing at all.

This has been his convention signature. With the INSANE lines he's had I imagine they told him to speed it up, and this is what we're left with now.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:
First of all, that Quinn signature is way worse than the worst of his bad GoT signatures. It's a nothing at all.

This has been his convention signature. With the INSANE lines he's had I imagine they told him to speed it up, and this is what we're left with now.

I can't accept that as the reason. For free, perhaps you can't complain. For the cost of convention money, and knowing that he has demonstrated a more complete signature before, I would definitely complain. The thing that slows down lines is when the celebrity might actually talk to the fans or take a picture, which is sometimes separate and sometimes not.

That signature is paid for, and the number of tickets is regulated. It's called the "money signature" and it darn well should be what you get.

Also any on-card and/or sticker contracts have no immediate time element involved. They are being paid for the job too. There is no reason for the celebrities not to give the best autographs that they are capable of writing. If they don't, it's because they don't care and they deserve to be called out for it.

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:
Is this going to be a regular hobby box release from ZeroCool for once?

It would appear so, box prices are being quoted at roughly $140 but nothing so far on insert ratios.

As far as I can tell at this point, this won't be a regular hobby box release in the sense that card shops may not be ordering it. I have been informed that everyone must order directly from the Topps website at the same price. The only way to make a profit is to then mark up the product and hope it sells.

If this is correct, ZeroCool is doing what some people said it would do all along. It's cutting out the middleman, be it the big distributor or the dealer. There is no difference between wholesale price and retail price as far as buying from them and no incentive for bulk buying.

Now I'm not sure about how well that will work, if in fact that is the plan. There are advantages to having wholesalers on call and a dedicated network of accounts that will always buy product at the discount off SRP.

But if the product sells out without the network, then it stands to reason that they don't need the network. If ZeroCool can't move all the product at the price point its set, that's when it needs the authorized middlemen they no longer have. From a business model standpoint, I think it's interesting to see what will happen with this "Stranger Things" product, which should have at least more demand than a title like "Jacka$$".

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:

quote:

Originally posted by mykdude:

quote:

Originally posted by Raven:
Is this going to be a regular hobby box release from ZeroCool for once?

It would appear so, box prices are being quoted at roughly $140 but nothing so far on insert ratios.

As far as I can tell at this point, this won't be a regular hobby box release in the sense that card shops may not be ordering it. I have been informed that everyone must order directly from the Topps website at the same price. The only way to make a profit is to then mark up the product and hope it sells.

If this is correct, ZeroCool is doing what some people said it would do all along. It's cutting out the middleman, be it the big distributor or the dealer. There is no difference between wholesale price and retail price as far as buying from them and no incentive for bulk buying.

Now I'm not sure about how well that will work, if in fact that is the plan. There are advantages to having wholesalers on call and a dedicated network of accounts that will always buy product at the discount off SRP.

But if the product sells out without the network, then it stands to reason that they don't need the network. If ZeroCool can't move all the product at the price point its set, that's when it needs the authorized middlemen they no longer have. From a business model standpoint, I think it's interesting to see what will happen with this "Stranger Things" product, which should have at least more demand than a title like "Jacka$$".

This is incorrect.

There will be hobby product, and I've been offered it by a wholesale distributor.

There will also be a retail component, and I will be carrying blaster boxes as well.

And, so far, the Season 4 set has not hit Topps Website yet. There is, however, a website exclusive Stranger Things Fright Flicks box. These have not been offered at wholesale, so I'm assuming Topps is keeping that one to themselves.

But you are not incorrect that Fanatics is shifting how cards are bought and sold. And you'll see more web exclusive products if these make money.

Actually, the collector benefits as the buy in is cheaper. Until it's not. When Fanatics completes the change, they can sell at whatever price they want.

Small dealers and shops are going to be hit hardest as they likely won't be able to buy from Fanatics directly except at full retail. Large dealers and shops who accept Fanatics terms, do have an option to purchase some items direct.

Ed

Ed, I was inquiring about "Stranger Things Season Four" hobby boxes, that I think come out at the end of this month, and I was advised to buy direct as my LHS will not be getting any, although they always did before.

Perhaps they use a different distributor than you, or they feel that they don't have a large enough profit margin to play with on this one. Whether it is still called a hobby box or not, Fanatics is changing, or trying to change, how we get it.

You posted:
"Actually, the collector benefits as the buy is cheaper. Until it's not. When Fanatics completes the change, they can sell at whatever price they want."

"Small dealers and shops are going to be hit hardest as they likely won't be able to buy from Fanatics directly except at full retail. Large dealers and shops who except Fanatics terms, do have an option to purchase some items direct."

Yes and yes, except that I don't really think the collector benefits either, at least not on in-demand hot product. You can get still get whatever poor selling products Fanatics decides to dump at discounted prices later on, but they are monopolizing the price in distribution, and restricting wholesalers. There is no room for dealers to discount off of SRP after release if they are all buying at that price, because then its immediately below their cost.

Plus, even if the dealers accept their terms, they only get more options "to purchase some items direct", which is still necessary to control the allocation of orders. We agree that the only thing that will stop this change is if Fanatics web exclusive products lose money, but then they also have the alternative of using brick and mortar retail outlets. So this hobby shifting of Topps cards has many shifts to go.

quote:

Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
There will be hobby product, and I've been offered it by a wholesale distributor.

There will also be a retail component, and I will be carrying blaster boxes as well.

This is where my biggest issue lies - their lack of information. Their business model seems to be "Keep 'em guessing" which is REALLY turning me off. I don't want to buy a product when a week later they might release it in a new configuration, which may be better (already seen it with Star Wars).

In a lot of ways this is similar to ePack. Upper Deck raised the prices, increased print runs and/or watered down releases and now most sets aren't seeing out. Eventually I suspect they will have a sale.

For me, with really no options to buy locally, this is better as at least I have a place I can buy cards. . .

I still think that offering quantity discounts should be the way that buyers are differentiated. . . Seems like that would work in a web model as well.

Ok, finally a check list and am glad I refrained from jumping on.

There are 23 autograph cards total. 11 for Vecna, 11 for Eddie and 1 Dual card.

A total of 63,600 packs or 10,600 boxes or 1 autograph in every 460 boxes.

You need at least 2 boxes ($100) to complete a base set.

10,600 X 50 = $530,000 which = evil card manufacturer.