Is there a difference between a seller telling me they don't have the card or me telling the seller I don't have the money after the purchase?

Not that it happens all that often but I did get hit with it twice in the last two weeks and it has me a little irritated.

I'm thinking that I am more likely to get negative feedback for non payment than a seller is for not having the item. Should buyers start hitting a bad feedback when this happens?

Thoughts?

Yes, I think buyers should post negative feedback when the seller sells something they don't actually have. . .

That said personally for me it comes down to the rarity/cost of the item. If the seller doesn't have something I can easily get somewhere else I just move on and buy it elsewhere, but if it is one of a kind or rare then I am more motivated to leave feedback.

As a rule I just don't even bother leaving feedback anymore.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: webjon,

It boils down to will you want to buy from them again because they will almost certainly block you if you leave negative feedback .

One ebay seller I regularly buy from is hopeless at listing and also general administration leading to mistakes in what I receive and when I get it . However those same bad practices mean I often pick up bargains because items are incorrectly described so I accept the odd bad experience .

It depends on whether or not you believe it was an honest mistake. Some sellers are sloppy with their inventory records and forget to remove things they have already sold. Or they list it in multiple places and forget all the places. Even when its honest, it should be a rare occurrence and not a pattern.

When it happens all the time, there is something wrong with the way the seller does business. When it happens only when the buyer got a really good deal, something else is wrong. When it happens only on really rare items in high demand with many offers, then something else is wrong. If you see a prior pattern, something else is wrong. If you have a gut feeling, you're probably right.

I agree that once you leave negative feedback you can not go back.

I've learnt over the years that if someone is nice and sends you a nice thing then you should leave them some nice feedback.

Now if someone is nasty you SHOULD leave them a massive negative, however, if you do prepare to get one in return and don't bother contacting ebay to tell them that it is unfair because they do not want to know.

Better to just kick the dog and move on.

This happened to me recently with a card. I bought it but then the seller messaged that she couldn't find it and refunded me my money. It wasn't in NM-MT condition so it wasn't like it was undervalued. I don't know how someone loses something they were selling unless she spilled soda or something on it and was embarrassed. There are still a lot of people on Ebay that aren't good businesspeople.

Jess

quote:

I'm thinking that I am more likely to get negative feedback for non payment than a seller is for not having the item.

Actually, No.

Sellers cannot give buyers negative feedback. No pay, damaged returns, flat out fraud. Does not matter. Sellers can only leave positive feedback.

And that my friends is why the feedback system is worthless.

Ed

Hi Ed,

I haven't sold on Ebay since around 2006. That was back when you could still take checks and money orders as payment. A seller could leave negative feedback then. A buyer had won an auction but then wouldn't pay me. He would say he was going to pay, but after a couple of weeks, I got tired of it and left him negative feedback. He then left it for me. He had no grounds to do that and I messaged Ebay but I was stuck with it for a few years. It magically disappeared at some point. One day, I noticed it was gone.

When I can't pay, I don't try to win an auction. Call me old-fashioned.

Jess

quote:

Originally posted by catskilleagle:

Call me old-fashioned.

Jess

If you insist, hi old fashioned.

The system changed a few years ago to give all the feedback advantage to the buyer. I had a case about a year ago, I sold a card and sent into the buyer. The buyer then claimed to ebay/paypal the card was damaged. Had a big crease in it. (It did not). Ebay basicly strongarmed me into accepting it back. It was not the card I mailed to the person. I contacted ebay to let them know the buyer has switched the card. Sorry I was out of luck. I lost money and got a defective card. There was nothing I could do to warn other sellers about this guy. Royally sucked.

A friend of mine, who is also here on Card Talk, won an autographed card several years ago from a particular ebay seller, located overseas.

After he paid, the Seller refunded his money and said that he would not sell the item to him, because he did not like something which he posted on Card Talk.

I am still surprised that there really isn't a viable alternative to eBay.

Sellers have been complaining about eBay in one way or another for years, yet they don't seem to be backing any other selling platform.

You rarely even see dealers trying to sell singles on forums anymore. Very few dealers have websites, and the ones that do rarely (if ever) seem to try to self-promote. Given the fees to use eBay and the issues discussed above you'd think that they would be trying to sell off eBay. I dunno -- they must be doing just fine with eBay and whatever else they are doing -- maybe I am missing something.

To be fair they could be trying to sell on Facebook. I rarely look on Facebook for much.

I don't think COMC is taking a significant bite out of eBay's traffic, but I prefer buying on COMC or trading on ePack partially to avoid all the shenanigans. I don't need to worry about issues with getting shipped a different card that I bought or anything like that.

To be fair getting cards shipped from ePack/COMC takes forever and is expensive so there are significant downsides too.

There is still direct buying, as long as you are able to contact a seller yourself and don't mind forfeiting the buyer protection that gives eBay its advantage. Most card dealers are happy to establish good relationships with collectors who will return, but you must pay first and know that you are doing business with a reputable person. You can buy cards like you did before eBay, but it is more limited to who you are willing to trust and what they can get and there is more risk. Most people take the easier route and have to put up with all the rules that occasionally bite them.

Sellers may hate eBay, but that's where the buyers/collectors prefer to go, so it's a necessary evil.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Raven,

If there are dealers who are trying to drive buyers to buy from their websites or direct from them directly they are doing a horrible job.

I know because I've spent a lot of time in the last couple of months searching for them.

I found 4 or 5 active websites where people are selling individual cards.

Most are like the retailer forum on Card Talk -- no updates since 2017.

I haven't seen any forum posts where dealers are trying to sell anything.

Webjon, how do you suggest one promote?

You can't promote on Card Talk. Not sure why the retailer forum is still there. You can't buy in and could never conduct business there.

You can't promote on Blowout, they are run by a retailer.

Lots happens on Facebook, but it's still a needle in a haystack.

I advertise in NSU. Used to advertise in The Wrapper. Neither brings big numbers of customers.

I include website information in every eBay package that ships. But see little return for that advertising.

Curious what you think retailers should do to get noticed. And I'm serious, I really would like to know.

Ed

quote:

Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
Webjon, how do you suggest one promote?

That's a tough question. My initial comment was that I'm still surprised there really isn't a viable alternative to eBay.

My second comment was "If there are dealers who are trying to drive buyers to buy from their websites..." The point I was trying to make is -- maybe there just aren't dealers who are trying to drive buyers to their own websites or to buying direct. In hours of searching I've only found 4-5 dealers with active websites where they are selling single cards. More dealers sell sealed product, and several dealers sell sealed sports product with occassional sealed entertainment product.

So -- that's my question, or my point -- are there dealers who are trying to drive traffic to their own direct sales?

You are already doing more than any other dealer I am aware of -- your newsletter is fantastic, you have your own show, you set up at tons of shows, you make promos, you actually have an active website, etc. Your website was the first one I went to when looking for singles.

How can/should a dealer promote themselves probably should be it's own thread as I am guessing/hoping that other people may have suggestions -- and the reality is that the 'communities' online are now so fragmented that many companies (not card companies, obviously) literally have teams of people who determine online/social marketing strategies.

My only suggestion is to post. Post everywhere. Post often. See where you get your best 'bang for your buck.'

I'm not clear on what the rules are on Blowout. They have rules against selling supplies and boxes. Then they have an odd 'no commercial posts' rule. . . which seems to be a blanket way to shut down anything they don't like.

Since Blowout is the most active card forum I'm aware of I'd suggest you post on there. I'd be as soft and gentle as possible -- post box breakdowns, for example. I get that to some degree this is promoting for the benefit of one of your competitors, but there are buyers there, and blowout doesn't break down any product.

One other suggestion -- post with the sole intention of getting responses. Get people engaging with you no matter what the platform.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: webjon,

Here is my rant for the year.
I do not like leaving feedback ,why should a buyer be able to punch when a sellers hands are tied?
Some buyers like it as it ups their standing buy I think it is a unnecessary thing
I have had a few items with late delivery by late I mean 6 months
the sellers have reimbursed me and when they have been received I have tried to get the payments back to the seller.
But this is hard as some sellers have blocked me and then there is no way to get back to them, so sellers do not be in a hurry to block a buyer
I had one seller who packed a very expensive card into a bubble envelope with no top loader and in a cellophane cover it got lost when i received it it was badly creased etc i complained to him regarding his packaging etc and told him if he wanted the card back to pay for the return shipping as I had already spent enough and I would not leave negative feedback he replied keep it .
He reimbursed my money for the card which i did not ask for but should of then blocked me
I would of still purchased items off him if he had not blocked
I try not to get E Bay involved in matters like ths as I think this dose more damage than good
My second item is Card Trading I read all the trading and wants lists that are put up on the forum and notice that there are really not that many trades done
The main thing i think is that as for my main collecting interest as I only want about a dozen items most trades that are put up these cards are not on them I might have cards that a person asks for but he dose not have anything I want so no trade
I am sure that a lot of traders will sell cards but owing to the forum restrictions can not
I think that there should be a link somewere mabey in the advertising or at the end of the trade list the person can put up a sign or post
Willing to also sell with a link to their E Mail etc
And think about International buyers
Anyway enough rambling
Merry Xmas everyone