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What is the state of counterfeits in entertainment cards?
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Gold Card Talk Member
posted
I haven't followed what has been happening in the hobby with regards to counterfeit autographs in the last several years as my collecting focus shifted. . . I don't see many people talk about counterfeits anymore.

Clearly with the increase in prices the profit motive for counterfeiting autographs has never been higher.

I'm starting to look at filling in some gaps in my collection now and I'm wondering what the current market looks like.

Is anyone looking for counterfeits anymore? I have to assume they are out there still. . .
 
Posts: 4843 | Location: Parts Unknown. | Registered: January 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
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I don't know if there is a "state" of counterfeit non-sport cards but it is always a concern with any collectible of this sort.

I think most of my purchasing practices put me in a low category for being taken in by counterfeits but knowing the real product is the best defense. Card companies have done much to make the process more complicated. I always look for those features when I receive anything I purchase.

If you get something that is questionable there are always the online chat boards to run a comparisons with. Blow out forum has received some notoriety for calling out certain card company discrepancies.
 
Posts: 3594 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
Picture of Raven
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So I'm assuming we are talking about the counterfeiting of certified autograph cards only, not counterfeit autographs in general.

It isn't an easy or casual thing to counterfeit a certified autograph card. Both the card has to be made, complete with any watermarks or seals or security additions, and the signature has to be forged. If its a high dollar card, which is the only kind it would make sense to do this way, it will also probably be a short printed card. It's not like anyone could do 1000 fake cards on something that had 50 copies and not be noticed.

With today's technology and the prices of some sports cards in particular, signed and unsigned, I wouldn't say its impossible or that someone isn't doing it. However I also don't see it as being necessarily a "state" of the hobby because it isn't a general problem the way that fake autographs on uncertified cards or merchandise is a recurrent big problem.

Now what I have always worried about and frequently mention is the release of unsigned certified cards into the market by either the card makers or other unknown sources. An unsigned certified card can be signed by anyone and then you have a fake autograph on an authentic card. Go ahead and find that for sure if the card was released. If the card was never release, the buyer still has to know that or believe the story that it got signed some place else. Licensed unsigned certified cards should always be destroyed by the maker or permanently marked. They are too dangerous to get into the wild, but they do.
 
Posts: 8566 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Titanium Card Talk Member
Picture of wolfie
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How about the Hammer Horror autographs from Cornerstone. They were a generic design with a place for the autograph.

There are unsigned cards around of those, now i get one of those and get some actor from a Hammer movie to sign it.

Now i have an authentic card with a proper autograph on it but this card was never in the set.

____________________
Come, it is time for you to keep your appointment with The Wicker Man.
 
Posts: 28490 | Location: wolverhampton staffs uk | Registered: July 19, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
Picture of Raven
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quote:
Originally posted by wolfie:
How about the Hammer Horror autographs from Cornerstone. They were a generic design with a place for the autograph.

There are unsigned cards around of those, now i get one of those and get some actor from a Hammer movie to sign it.

Now i have an authentic card with a proper autograph on it but this card was never in the set.


An authentic card yes, but not an authentic certified autograph card because the card maker just made a card with a blank space. You're right, that's just asking for trouble and you, as the owner who got it signed, would need documentation to prove the signing or it would just be an unconfirmed signed card.

These are grey areas that cause confusion and much of it is because the card makers don't think things through. Just as those easily removable little gold star stickers make it impossible to trust expensive Star Pics autograph cards of the early '90s.

Someone is always going to take advantage of it, but only for certain things. Is there a big demand for old Hammer Horror autographs? Maybe a few, but common signers are generally not worth any professional effort to mass produce forged signatures on anything.
 
Posts: 8566 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Silver Card Talk Member
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Yeah, that is the concern of unsigned autograph cards leaking onto the market. Generally, these aren't big money cards anyway so the danger level is low. Sellers tend to greatly overestimate the value of many of them and that actually helps the hobby because no one is going to buy a $60-100 card and get it signed (or fake the signature) for something that sells for MAYBE something over $100.

One example of that would be the Roger Moore autograph card from The Saint (SA1) by Unstoppable. I've definitely seen an unsigned sample of that offered from about $70 to over $100. There's no money in buying that card and faking the signature because other sellers have offered the real autograph for around or even less than $100.
 
Posts: 2271 | Location: San Jose, CA, USA | Registered: December 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
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Generally speaking collectors know when unsigned cards are out there. They have just as much potential to be signed by the celebrity as a forged signature. It's really up to the buyer to figure out which is which.

I don't really consider such things as counterfeit in the sense that a fake card is produced to look like a real one.
 
Posts: 3594 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
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Thanks everyone. . .

Back when I was researching cards I was finding very questionable cards that were in the $20 range -- the one that comes to mind is Brian Krause from Charmed. This has never been an expensive card, it has watermarks and foil stamping. . .

So I always assume it is possible a card I am looking at has been faked.

It has been a number of years since I've paid attention to counterfeits so the counterfeiters have had a number of years to fake more cards, an I'm sure technology has improved over those years.

I have seen cards get called out on Blowout from time to time.

I appreciate the help.

Thanks.

BTW -- for what it is worth I just checked eBay for what I consider pretty obviously questionable cards and I wasn't able to find as many as I was expecting.
 
Posts: 4843 | Location: Parts Unknown. | Registered: January 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
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The other issue is that misprints and cuts are certainly more rare today but they do happen.

Sometimes if you look too close you may claim an honest production error as counterfeit.
 
Posts: 3594 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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