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Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
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quote:
Originally posted by webjon:

I do suspect that many of the PSA graded Marvel commons cards that were selling for insane money will come back to earth as PSA works through their backlog and more of these cards come to market.


By "market" you mean pop report.....right? Wink

There are now 6,518 graded 1990 Marvel Universe cards just for PSA. Nearly 5000 of them are 9's and 10's.
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
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quote:
Originally posted by mykdude:

By "market" you mean pop report.....right? Wink

There are now 6,518 graded 1990 Marvel Universe cards just for PSA. Nearly 5000 of them are 9's and 10's.


Indeed.

Is 5000 a lot? I have no idea, but it seems like a lot, and I bet there are a ton more that are still waiting to be graded at PSA.
 
Posts: 5130 | Location: Parts Unknown. | Registered: January 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by webjon:
quote:
Originally posted by mykdude:

By "market" you mean pop report.....right? Wink

There are now 6,518 graded 1990 Marvel Universe cards just for PSA. Nearly 5000 of them are 9's and 10's.


Indeed.

Is 5000 a lot? I have no idea, but it seems like a lot, and I bet there are a ton more that are still waiting to be graded at PSA.


Compared to the few hundred that were graded when this mess started. Given the quality of Impel's print standards and the rise of the card protection industry at the time, I would imagine if we could grade them all that the majority
would still hit in the top 3.

Yeah I agree, the numbers are only going to go up. And this is just one pop report.
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by mykdude:

Compared to the few hundred that were graded when this mess started. Given the quality of Impel's print standards and the rise of the card protection industry at the time, I would imagine if we could grade them all that the majority
would still hit in the top 3.

Yeah I agree, the numbers are only going to go up. And this is just one pop report.


Totally agree -- had this argument a few times on Blowout with newbies who assured me that I was wrong -- that 1990 Marvel Universe cards were rare in good condition. . .
 
Posts: 5130 | Location: Parts Unknown. | Registered: January 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
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I noticed that the 1993 Nike Aerospace 12 sticker set (Michael Jordan with Looney Tunes characters) that was packaged in a CD case with a mini-sticker sheet has been selling for less than it had been. Earlier this year, it had been selling for $400 to over $1100 but it's been going for $300-400 in the past month. The stickers appear to be the same as the ones you could buy separately (mini-sticker set also the same and was sold separately), but in the CD case with Nike and Looney Tunes stickers on it, it was a much less common promo piece.

Jess


quote:
Originally posted by webjon:
People on Blowout and Facebook are starting to note that prices on individual cards have already started to slide.

Anecdotally I picked up some Ultra Spider-Man on COMC when that was selling out on ePack with the intention of flipping it when the product dried up, but the prices on virtually everything I bought have dropped. Obviously that wasn't very long ago.
 
Posts: 3290 | Location: San Jose, CA, USA | Registered: December 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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People on Blowout started complaining about the slide in Marvel card prices too.

I do think that rare items are not going to fall in price much, but the common stuff is falling back to earth quickly.

I've noticed some items I have been watching have been selling much more slowly and for a lower price.

Sealed wax still seems expensive.
 
Posts: 5130 | Location: Parts Unknown. | Registered: January 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by webjon:
People on Blowout started complaining about the slide in Marvel card prices too.

I do think that rare items are not going to fall in price much, but the common stuff is falling back to earth quickly.

I've noticed some items I have been watching have been selling much more slowly and for a lower price.

Sealed wax still seems expensive.


If one is going play the high grade value game with the early 90's Marvel product the holograms seem to have a more balanced population report. Not so easy to get a 10 with a card that started to receive damage as soon as it was placed in the pack by the manufacturer.

Roughly 8000 90 and 91 Impel Marvel cards have been sent to PSA for grading. Their only complaint is that they need to train and hire more graders.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mykdude,
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Raven
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Saw this on Blowout and tried to check it out. According to the poster, graded gem mint #10s of 1990 Marvel Universe Wolverine #23 were selling for over $2,000 a few months ago. Now one just sold for $142.

So one did sell on eBay for $152 on June 12th. The other sales I saw did not go back months and were not on gem mint 10s. I didn't look long, so I can't confirm what high prices they hit. However someone is trying to sell one at $1800 with Best Offer.

Now I think $152 for a card that may have been trading for under $5 a couple of years ago and was collecting dust for 30 years is great. But God help anyone who bought that after it was graded and paid hundreds or thousands of dollars as it climbed the invisible ladder. When the population report catches up to all the other gem mint Wolverines submitted and still trying to work their way through the grading backlog, $152 will be a thing of the past too.

This is very sad for anyone who truly bought into it thinking they had an investment quality card because of the grading. All of the warnings got drowned out as "buzzkill", but in the end there will be real victims of this kind of hype, which will just move onto some other product. Meanwhile the graders have made a fortune and the pumpers have sold all their cards. Shake Head
 
Posts: 9348 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Silver Card Talk Member
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quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
Saw this on Blowout and tried to check it out. According to the poster, graded gem mint #10s of 1990 Marvel Universe Wolverine #23 were selling for over $2,000 a few months ago. Now one just sold for $142.

So one did sell on eBay for $152 on June 12th. The other sales I saw did not go back months and were not on gem mint 10s. I didn't look long, so I can't confirm what high prices they hit. However someone is trying to sell one at $1800 with Best Offer.

Now I think $152 for a card that may have been trading for under $5 a couple of years ago and was collecting dust for 30 years is great. But God help anyone who bought that after it was graded and paid hundreds or thousands of dollars as it climbed the invisible ladder. When the population report catches up to all the other gem mint Wolverines submitted and still trying to work their way through the grading backlog, $152 will be a thing of the past too.

This is very sad for anyone who truly bought into it thinking they had an investment quality card because of the grading. All of the warnings got drowned out as "buzzkill", but in the end there will be real victims of this kind of hype, which will just move onto some other product. Meanwhile the graders have made a fortune and the pumpers have sold all their cards. Shake Head


Here are all the PSA 10 sales of #23 that I can find that went over $1000:

April 1, 2021 - $1247.22 (auction)
March 28, 2021 - $2027.22 (auction)
February 24, 2021 - $1752 (auction)
February 19, 2021 - $1723 (auction)
January 31, 2021 - $1499.99 (Buy It Now)

Those are the only eBay sales I see where the #23 card sold for over $1000 in a PSA 10. Last Spring it was basically a $50-$60 card in a 10. And now it's trending back down near those prices again. So those who overpaid got themselves carried away in the hype-machine that only lasted for about 3 months. Shake Head
 
Posts: 2130 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: September 14, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
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That's been quite a ride for that card -- sheesh.

I think that rare cards will continue to sell at elevated prices -- not sure how elevated, but I think this exposed how rare certain entertainment cards are while exposing how common other entertainment cards are.

I don't feel bad for people who speculated on these and lost. There were plenty of warnings, and they knew they were speculating.

Black Diamond is interesting. . . seems to be selling at crazy high prices. . . what does that mean? Are new releases are going to be crazy expensive while the PSA grading on the 1990s cards has died? Are the speculators going to look for a new 'old' set to pump and dump?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: webjon,
 
Posts: 5130 | Location: Parts Unknown. | Registered: January 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yes latley on Blowout there has been a few members noting the lower prices being obtained for some cards
I take it that they are wondering if the bubble has popped
 
Posts: 705 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: November 22, 2016Reply With QuoteReport This Post



Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
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Noticing a strange contrast.

When I search ebay for 1990 Marvel Universe PSA I pull 1,275 results.

When I search 1990 Marvel Universe Beckett I pull 0 results.

PSA pop report shows that 9,724 cards have been submitted. 3,587 10's and 3,439 9's which is just above 70%

Beckett pop report shows 414 cards have been submitted. There is 1 10, 71 9's, 158 8's and 86 7's. Almost reads like believable results.

If you were to multiply Beckett's numbers to equal PSA it would look like this.

23 10's, 1667 9's, 3697 8s and 2012 7's.

With that kind of record it would be easy to see why collectors/hype hounds would prefer one grading service over the other.

It also brings into question the standards of grading. Is a 10 really a 10?
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
Picture of Raven
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Try using 1990 Marvel Universe BGS and you will see results. It's the word Beckett that doesn't work. Also if you just do 1990 Marvel Universe Graded you will get most of them.

PSA does seem to have a wide lead in popularity over BGS by the numbers, but people who get their cards graded often have specific reasons for which one they choose. Some think they can get better or more lenient/favorable grading with one or the other.

The most important thing is that you can't use some fly by night grading service that has little history and no reputation. There are a couple out there that have folded up over the years and the cards that are in their slabs might just as well be resubmitted because there is no longer any support for the grading from a deceased company. Kind of like a COA from someone you can't find. Big Grin
 
Posts: 9348 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of mykdude
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
Try using 1990 Marvel Universe BGS and you will see results. It's the word Beckett that doesn't work. Also if you just do 1990 Marvel Universe Graded you will get most of them.

PSA does seem to have a wide lead in popularity over BGS by the numbers, but people who get their cards graded often have specific reasons for which one they choose. Some think they can get better or more lenient/favorable grading with one or the other.

The most important thing is that you can't use some fly by night grading service that has little history and no reputation. There are a couple out there that have folded up over the years and the cards that are in their slabs might just as well be resubmitted because there is no longer any support for the grading from a deceased company. Kind of like a COA from someone you can't find. Big Grin


Ok BGS search still falls in line with the Beckett Pop report.

I am fully aware of second rate grading companies but Beckett is not one of them. There is still a disparity between the two that would lead one to think Beckett is running a higher grading standard.
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Raven
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quote:
Originally posted by mykdude:
Ok BGS search still falls in line with the Beckett Pop report.

I am fully aware of second rate grading companies but Beckett is not one of them. There is still a disparity between the two that would lead one to think Beckett is running a higher grading standard.


I think you're right and a lot of the people sending cards in for grading are interested in getting back the high grades, but not having the higher standards to do it. Big Grin

I don't give a darn about graded cards and I still think that most non-sport card collectors don't give a darn about them either. But high graded cards sell for a premium, or try to sell for a premium, and that's where your market is. Graded cards are a separate market to itself and the people who trade in graded cards are either the "discriminating" collectors looking for pristine condition or the flippers/sellers who are trying to keep turning it over for the profit margin each time.

I get the impression that PSA is the preferred choice of flippers, but it may not be just for a more relaxed standard of grading. It could be bulk cost to grade multiple cards or speed of return.
 
Posts: 9348 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of mykdude
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quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
I don't give a darn about graded cards


I am pretty much the same way. The graded cards I do have are all incidental. I have never submitted for one.

Still I do keep my eyes open for where the next big investigation will hammer the greed mongers in the hobby. Grading and Authentication is making way too much money not to have suspicion.
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Platinum Card Talk Member
Picture of Raven
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Suspicion you say. Big Grin Whatever happened to that big FBI investigation about repaired cards and grading that no one mentions anymore? Wherever there is big money there is corruption and people abusing the system and other people getting scammed. You don't have to be a conspiracy theorist to know its true. Wink
 
Posts: 9348 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gold Card Talk Member
Picture of chesspieceface
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by mykdude:
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
Try using 1990 Marvel Universe BGS and you will see results. It's the word Beckett that doesn't work. Also if you just do 1990 Marvel Universe Graded you will get most of them.

PSA does seem to have a wide lead in popularity over BGS by the numbers, but people who get their cards graded often have specific reasons for which one they choose. Some think they can get better or more lenient/favorable grading with one or the other.

The most important thing is that you can't use some fly by night grading service that has little history and no reputation. There are a couple out there that have folded up over the years and the cards that are in their slabs might just as well be resubmitted because there is no longer any support for the grading from a deceased company. Kind of like a COA from someone you can't find. Big Grin


Ok BGS search still falls in line with the Beckett Pop report.

I am fully aware of second rate grading companies but Beckett is not one of them. There is still a disparity between the two that would lead one to think Beckett is running a higher grading standard.


A Beckett 9.5 is equivalent to a PSA 10.
That Beckett has a 10 grade (known as Pristine as opposed to Gem Mint for the PSA 10) is one of the draws of BGS for collectors submitting especially nice condition cards. Beckett also gives half grades (like 8.5, 9.5, etc.), and issues subgrades for corners, edges, surface, and centering, neither of which PSA does. BGS cases are also thicker and heavier.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: chesspieceface,

____________________
Everywhere around this burg they're running out of verbs, adverbs, and adjectives. Everywhere around this town, they're running out of nouns.
 
Posts: 3085 | Location: California | Registered: December 23, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of mykdude
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by chesspieceface:

A Beckett 9.5 is equivalent to a PSA 10.
That Beckett has a 10 grade (known as Pristine as opposed to Gem Mint for the PSA 10) is one of the draws of BGS for collectors submitting especially nice condition cards. Beckett also gives half grades (like 8.5, 9.5, etc.), and issues subgrades for corners, edges, surface, and centering, neither of which PSA does. BGS cases are also thicker and heavier.


You are probably right but even with half grades a 10 should always be a 10. Any flaw that would make one say 9.5 is not a 10. PSA should be making the 9.5's 9's.....or adopt the half grade system.

On the other end of the spectrum it's pretty crazy to run a ebay search for PSA 10, select sold and then lowest price first. At page 21 (more than a 1000 auctions) you start to hit the $10 mark. People tend to forget that rare is only half the equation for value.

Oh well, as I have said before PSA always wins.
 
Posts: 4066 | Location: Tennessee | Registered: March 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I almost bought a graded card once. It was priced about the same as the card was going ungraded.

It was 2001 that I first noticed that someone had had a non-sports card graded. I think it was a Buffy promo.


quote:
Originally posted by mykdude:
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
I don't give a darn about graded cards


I am pretty much the same way. The graded cards I do have are all incidental. I have never submitted for one.

Still I do keep my eyes open for where the next big investigation will hammer the greed mongers in the hobby. Grading and Authentication is making way too much money not to have suspicion.
 
Posts: 3290 | Location: San Jose, CA, USA | Registered: December 23, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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