Non-Sport Update's Card Talk
Card Collecting Terms

This topic can be found at:
http://nonsportupdate.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/954605353/m/5957026296

March 24, 2020, 08:39 AM
Raven
Card Collecting Terms
quote:
Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
I figure I'll have some free time since I don't foresee any shows happening for several months. At this point I think we might be lucky to get the Fall shows in.

Ed


The New York ComicCon is in October, same weekend as your Chicago show. Right now they are converting the Javits Center, where it always stays, into a 1000s bed hospital. Frown

I prefer to stay optimistic for now. They are just trying the malaria drug remedy on severe cases here starting today. If it works well the strategy will change quickly. If it doesn't we are in it for the long haul I'm afraid.
April 01, 2020, 05:29 AM
bealay
I just noticed PSC -Personal Sketch Card - is not listed, that's very widely used

____________________
I run MCCW (Marvel Card Collectors Worldwide) on FB
Co-host the Marvel Card Collectors Podcast https://anchor.fm/mccp
https://www.facebook.com/TheMCCPod/
I also collect Black Cat cards. Yeah, I'm that guy.
April 01, 2020, 07:55 AM
Raven
What would be the meaning of PSC? Is it a ACEO? Does it have to be a private commission? Might any unlicensed sketch be called a PSC? Or could you call a licensed card a PSC too?

That's one I have never used because I'm not sure what it's saying, but it I had to guess, I would think only a commissioned sketch could be a PSC and it isn't licensed. Right or wrong?
April 02, 2020, 04:01 AM
Scifi Cards
PSC, or Personal Sketch Card is tough to be concise with a definition.

All PSC's would be ACEO's, but not all ACEO's are PSC's because ACEO's can also be prints.

Any commission would be a PSC, since it was done personally for you. IF it's also an AP, then it's a licensed PSC, which is a bit of an oddity.

But an artist can also do a PSC and sell it, making it not exactly a commission but still a PSC.

I'm trying to fit that all in 2 sentences. Anyone want to give that a shot?

Ed

____________________
www.nonsportcardshows.com Home of the Chicago Non-Sport Card Show

Trading Page Now Online: http://www.scifi.cards/trading.html

Collecting Sketches of the Character Crystal

April 02, 2020, 10:29 AM
webjon
I think PSCs specifically are cards created on an artist's personal card stock.

An AP is an AP -- not a PSC.
April 02, 2020, 11:38 AM
Raven
quote:
Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
All PSC's would be ACEO's, but not all ACEO's are PSC's because ACEO's can also be prints.

Any commission would be a PSC, since it was done personally for you. IF it's also an AP, then it's a licensed PSC, which is a bit of an oddity.

Ed


All thumbs are fingers, but not all fingers are thumbs. Big Grin

I would agree with webjon that a PSC should be on personal card stock, but only because I feel it should not be licensed. An AP is on official card stock and carries at least the assumption of a license, even though it wasn't seeded in the actual product.

Originally I felt that a PSC should only be a commissioned sketch piece, rather than an ACEO, which already has a name. Upon reflection I see where that would be impossible to prove once the person who asked for the sketch to be created decided to sell it.

I really wouldn't count in the subject of prints at all in this, unless my idea of a print is incorrect. To me a print is like a facsimile autograph. It's just a copy of unlimited number. It is not authentic or genuine. It's just mass reproduced for distribution to the general public as an the image and is a shadow to the value of the original.

The sketch card has to be hand drawn to qualify as either a PSC or an ACEO to me. It might not be an original drawing in that the artist may have done many similar ones. However each repeated copy must be hand drawn, and not a manufactured print, before I would call it a real sketch under any term you want to assign to it.
April 02, 2020, 08:34 PM
Scifi Cards
I posted what I did in some ways tongue in cheek because I wanted to get a discussion going, but to also point out how difficult it is to define something like this in 1 or 2 sentences.

ACEO's include prints because that's the definition: Art Cards Editions and Original. Editions are prints. We can't ignore the editions because it's inconvenient. Also, you see prints on eBay listed as ACEO, so I feel you need to warn people of the possibility.

Now, on to PSC's and AP's. I would agree that if on AP stock, it's not really a PSC. But we have a situation now where you can buy a blank card and commission art on it. It's NOT an AP, and I would argue it's not licensed because it never went through the approval process and the artist may or may not have actually been contracted to work on that set. So does a commission on licensed stock become a PSC? You also have blank AP stock out there as well.

If this is confusing for us, think what it must be for a new collector just staring out.

Ed

____________________
www.nonsportcardshows.com Home of the Chicago Non-Sport Card Show

Trading Page Now Online: http://www.scifi.cards/trading.html

Collecting Sketches of the Character Crystal

April 02, 2020, 09:13 PM
Raven
quote:
Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
ACEO's include prints because that's the definition: Art Cards Editions and Original. Editions are prints. We can't ignore the editions because it's inconvenient. Also, you see prints on eBay listed as ACEO, so I feel you need to warn people of the possibility.

Ed


Well I'll just have to claim ignorance on that one. I do not buy them often, but I have never gotten an ACEO that wasn't an original sketch. Maybe I've been lucky, but I'm pretty sure the descriptions always indicated that they were hand drawn sketches.

I certainly would have no interest in buying a print the size of a sketch card. Perhaps as a framed painting on the wall, but not for a card.

So does a commission on licensed stock become a PSC, you ask. I would answer that by saying NO because to my mind a PSC should have no license. Since the card stock is licensed, and down the line any prospective buyer other than the original commissioning buyer would have no way of confirming whether or not the image was approved, the whole creation process can't be determined. So the best you can say is that if it is on licensed card stock, it might be licensed, but you still don't know for sure. Absent any proof, you know a license would be assumed, which would put it outside of an ACEO or a PSC.

The reverse is a lot simpler. If the card stock is from the artist and has no license indicated at all, it's safe to call it a PSA. That's why I would rather say that the deciding factor is based on the appearance of a license, even when there is none. Yeah, it's confusing indeed. Big Grin
April 07, 2020, 03:08 PM
FilmMkr
What does WMX mean when referencing trading cards? I keep seeing it on ebay listings. A Google search was no help.
April 07, 2020, 04:15 PM
webjon
quote:
Originally posted by FilmMkr:
What does WMX mean when referencing trading cards? I keep seeing it on ebay listings. A Google search was no help.


I only see that listed for one particular seller, my guess is that it is some inventory tracking note. . . not card related.
April 07, 2020, 04:32 PM
webjon
quote:
Originally posted by Scifi Cards:
Now, on to PSC's and AP's. I would agree that if on AP stock, it's not really a PSC. But we have a situation now where you can buy a blank card and commission art on it. It's NOT an AP, and I would argue it's not licensed because it never went through the approval process and the artist may or may not have actually been contracted to work on that set. So does a commission on licensed stock become a PSC? You also have blank AP stock out there as well.


I agree with you about the AP. If it doesn't go through the vetting process it's not a valid part of the set -- almost like a counterfeit or something of that nature.

An AP card is an AP card. I.E. if it is blank it is still an AP Card.

Perhaps an Artist Proof is an AP Card that has been completed by an approved artist and approved by the manufacturer/license holder.

A PSC is on personal card stock.

A commission a commission regardless of the stock.

There may be people who use these terms incorrectly, but I don't think that should be reinforced by adding it to a list of collecting definitions.
April 08, 2020, 01:19 AM
FilmMkr
When you search trading card dmx, the first two items in the search are being sold by different sellers, but you are correct that it is predominantly used by one seller. Thank you for the reply.
April 08, 2020, 11:07 AM
Raven
DMX is a rapper who has some autographed cards, so you might be seeing those. It also has to do with electronic equipment and comes up there too.

WMX means nothing to me for cards or anything else.

Looks like the only items that seller has offered is old complete card sets with WMX in the heading, so inventory tracking would hardly be it.

Why don't you ask the seller? If he tells you what it stands for you'll know and if he doesn't answer you, then you'll know something too. Wink
April 08, 2020, 04:26 PM
webjon
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
Looks like the only items that seller has offered is old complete card sets with WMX in the heading, so inventory tracking would hardly be it.


Why would you say that?

I've seen a lot of sellers, for example, at antique malls use codes like that to indicate that the inventory that was being sold was from a specific collection or consignor.
April 08, 2020, 04:51 PM
Raven
quote:
Originally posted by webjon:
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
Looks like the only items that seller has offered is old complete card sets with WMX in the heading, so inventory tracking would hardly be it.


Why would you say that?

I've seen a lot of sellers, for example, at antique malls use codes like that to indicate that the inventory that was being sold was from a specific collection or consignor.


Since this seller is using WMX as a tag for all his/her lots, there is no distinction. So it would all have to be from the same consignor or collection, if we are to assume that there is a consignor or collection. Since it's all the same, a tag would be unnecessary.

And before you say there could be more added, true. But take a look at the seller's history, or lack of history to be more precise. This is not a consignment service unless he/she just started it, although the account was opened in 2013. Thirteen sales in 12 months is not a business that needs tags to me, but it could mean whatever he/she thinks it means.

The best thing would be to ask the seller.
April 09, 2020, 08:12 AM
webjon
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
quote:
Originally posted by webjon:
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
Looks like the only items that seller has offered is old complete card sets with WMX in the heading, so inventory tracking would hardly be it.


Why would you say that?

I've seen a lot of sellers, for example, at antique malls use codes like that to indicate that the inventory that was being sold was from a specific collection or consignor.


Since this seller is using WMX as a tag for all his/her lots, there is no distinction. So it would all have to be from the same consignor or collection, if we are to assume that there is a consignor or collection. Since it's all the same, a tag would be unnecessary.

And before you say there could be more added, true. But take a look at the seller's history, or lack of history to be more precise. This is not a consignment service unless he/she just started it, although the account was opened in 2013. Thirteen sales in 12 months is not a business that needs tags to me, but it could mean whatever he/she thinks it means.

The best thing would be to ask the seller.


Ohh, so you are just making assumptions/guesses.

Got it.
April 09, 2020, 11:08 AM
Raven
quote:
Originally posted by webjon:
Ohh, so you are just making assumptions/guesses.

Got it.


As are you Jon. Big Grin You are the one who asked me "Why would you say that?" I gave you my reasoning. It doesn't look like the history of a consignment seller that needs to add codes. That's all I got. WMX is not a hobby term that I have seen used. If it's made up for whatever reason, great.

And if you require a definitive answer, ask the seller.
April 09, 2020, 01:10 PM
webjon
I made a guess.

No one cares what this term means.

I'm sorry I asked.
April 11, 2020, 04:03 AM
mykdude
Although I think some of this list is a bit self explanatory it's a great idea.

Reading the great rainbow debate, I do know the Rainbow Foil is at least an official Topps term for non sports.

I remember when refractor cards came out in sports and the term "rainbow" was often synonymous with the technology. Obviously, there are different refractor card types as they are used to tier sets into manufactured rarity. Refractor labels seem to change based on manufacturer or product title.

I think trying to lay out all the differences in a terminology guide would probably be a bit redundant.


In the area of art cards, do you think there should be a separate term for cards that are signed by both the artist and the celebrity that played the character? Leaf Masterworks or Star Wars Illustrated would be an example.
April 11, 2020, 05:30 AM
piko
The 2000 SDCC Spartacus set is described as Rainbow Foil