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Sketch cards.. good or bad?
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I love good quality, realistic sketches but was surprised to learn from a manufacture that some artists are using projectors to shine the image on a card and then sketch around it. Is this a common practice?

On another topic, I pulled a great B&W sketch from the early LOTR series from Topps, sent it back to the artest for coloring. I ended up with an even better sketch than I pulled. This practice is now not allowed my mfg's. Any one know why, what's the harm
 
Posts: 146 | Location: San Diego | Registered: May 28, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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CardFan, I like to draw and paint. I don't like using projectors, but I some cases I use erasers to create a clean artwork. The projectors are nothing new for many artist. I read people using that method to make wall drawings and paints because they aren't familiar with the size or want to make a good scale representation of the design artwork.

Also I read some Bios from some sketch artists and many of them aren't just working making sketch cards. So I can understand that maybe some of them are using some old artwork that nobody wanted to buy in a paper and to loose time they just transfer it to the card.
 
Posts: 242 | Location: Puerto Rico | Registered: December 15, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Mmmmmm Sketches are probably killing the hobby. If a collector is buying a sketch for $500 he/she is not buying boxes! I love sketches, I perhaps collect from 2 to say 7 sketches per set, and that's it. There is probably over-saturation at present. Color is good, but I also love black and white sketches / pencil sketches done well. I spend too much on sketches if truth be told, but it means I limit the number of set I go for, which is probably bad for dealers.
 
Posts: 1775 | Location: Wales, UK | Registered: June 10, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of goldenavenger
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quote:
Originally posted by CardFan:
I love good quality, realistic sketches but was surprised to learn from a manufacture that some artists are using projectors to shine the image on a card and then sketch around it. Is this a common practice?

On another topic, I pulled a great B&W sketch from the early LOTR series from Topps, sent it back to the artest for coloring. I ended up with an even better sketch than I pulled. This practice is now not allowed my mfg's. Any one know why, what's the harm


That's not as bad as some artists that will print off their printer and glue it on to the card and add color plus blend around the edge of the paper to make it less noticeable. Art come is different mediums and forms but as an official sketch card collector that's not what I want in my collection. I'm old school and want the entire sketch(or finished art) directly on the card.....but that's just me.

____________________
I'm looking for colored "Robots the Movie" sketch cards by Inkworks.

http://www.comicartfans.com/Ga...etail.asp?GCat=25744
 
Posts: 1841 | Location: OH, USA | Registered: April 18, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by igman7:
People are just too used to paying next to nothing for base/chase sets, in part do to some of the big busting dealers blowing things out from day one...which sets the market (and ruins it in many cases). One guy, if he breaks enough, can ruin an entire product's secondary marked on base/chase/autos by selling large quantities of cards cheap on release day (see latest Bond set).


I know dealers need to make more money; to stay in business; so we can keep buying cards from them - but frankly I don't think many collectors could afford to pay more at the moment and I'm quite happy for one dealer or several to 'set the market' as you put it if it means more collectors can add nice cards to their collection.

Besides, the people selling cheap only have so much product to go around which will eventually dry up and collectors will pay a little more in the end. And for all the buyers who score a card at $10 I see plenty of others paying double that in other auctions for the exact same thing.
Plus we can't 'blame' just big dealers can we? Set formats have changed and when you have sets made up entirely of rare cards today's 'Limited' and 'Very Limited' cards are the new 'common' cards. Just because a card is designated as a 'Very Limited' or such does not automatically mean a buyer can be gouged. The actor/character/actual rarity are the real factors when it comes to pricing.

Buyers are the ones who set the market and will pay only what they are willing to pay. I don't see why ANY card should cost a certain amount, I mean how much do you think a 'Limited' or 'Very Limited' auto from the new Bond set should cost? What in particular is being undersold? Should Brosnan & Craig be $1000 a piece?
 
Posts: 3124 | Location: England | Registered: June 23, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by wolfie:
quote:
Originally posted by igman7:
by selling large quantities of cards cheap on release day (see latest Bond set).


Just out of intrest what would you regard as cheap?


What are you regarding as expensive?
 
Posts: 3124 | Location: England | Registered: June 23, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I've seen some good and bad sketches Big Grin
 
Posts: 12088 | Location: England | Registered: September 16, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of X
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quote:
Originally posted by goldenavenger:
quote:
Originally posted by CardFan:
I love good quality, realistic sketches but was surprised to learn from a manufacture that some artists are using projectors to shine the image on a card and then sketch around it. Is this a common practice?

On another topic, I pulled a great B&W sketch from the early LOTR series from Topps, sent it back to the artest for coloring. I ended up with an even better sketch than I pulled. This practice is now not allowed my mfg's. Any one know why, what's the harm


That's not as bad as some artists that will print off their printer and glue it on to the card and add color plus blend around the edge of the paper to make it less noticeable. Art come is different mediums and forms but as an official sketch card collector that's not what I want in my collection. I'm old school and want the entire sketch(or finished art) directly on the card.....but that's just me.


Can you give us any examples of artists or specific cards which have glued on printed images? I would be genuinely interested to see what cards like this look like.

To answer the original question...

I think Sketch Cards are a VERY GOOD thing for the hobby because it provides a significant 'type' of card for people to enjoy, and who can call that a bad thing?

I don't really collect sketch cards but there are others who simply LOVE them, and if they can get excited over a new sketch set the same way I get excited over an autograph based set, or how another collector gets excited over a prop/costume based set, then I am very happy for them. This hobby is meant to be fun afterall!

I agree that there is probably an oversaturation of sketch cards at the moment, but I don't think that is bad because decents card should not cost hundreds of dollars as they used to. I remember when they really kicked off in popularity with the likes of star wars Heritage etc. where collectors (and one in particular) would pay obsecene amounts for near enough every card which go for a pittance nowadays. The irony is that whilst the overhyped nature of sketches has faded and people are willing to pay less, the quality of current offerings seems to (generally) be better.

That said, colour seems to be the official by-word for 'quality' nowadays which I don't really agree with. IMO not enough quality artists are producing good cards at the moment: there are too many sketches that look like a kid could do an equal or better job. Not every card needs a photo likeness but at least give it some flair, style and panache, otherwise don't bother. Similarly, more artists that have a real connection to the licence they are drawing for would not go amiss.

One aspect I really don't like about the world of sketch cards though is the over sensitive nature of many of the artists involved. Because art is such a personal and subjective thing you'll be damned if you criticise any individual's work. They'll post the work under the pretence of looking for criticism/feedback, when all they really want are compliments. Should you dare offer an opinion that doesn't enlarge their ego further you will be pounced upon by a never ending supply of sycophants who whisper adoring praise in their ears, even if the work is utter dreck. Devoted sketch card forums seem little more than rose-tinted love-ins and they are really tiresome to visit.

Whilst I am not gaga for sketch cards, I do have a whopping total of 11 official cards and 3 commissions (from 8 different artists) in my collection and I really enjoy all of them. Unlike completing traditional auto/costume runs where you want/need every single card I get more enjoyment from picking off a couple of sketch cards I REALLY like. No point in going after one card from each artist in a set when chances are you won't like most of the conributing artists' work.
 
Posts: 3124 | Location: England | Registered: June 23, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by wolfie:
quote:
Originally posted by igman7:
by selling large quantities of cards cheap on release day (see latest Bond set).


Just out of intrest what would you regard as cheap?


Props at 8.99, Toby Stephens and many other LTD autos at $12.99...I would have no issue with it if these were starting bids with a lack of interest, but these were BINson release day. Normally, a product will start strong and prices might get down to these levels, but if folks who are cracking tons of cases sell cards in this manner, it ruins the secondary market for everyone else...not that they care as they got their money back.

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Posts: 1492 | Location: Tinley Park, Illinois, USA | Registered: May 31, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by X:
quote:
Originally posted by igman7:
People are just too used to paying next to nothing for base/chase sets, in part do to some of the big busting dealers blowing things out from day one...which sets the market (and ruins it in many cases). One guy, if he breaks enough, can ruin an entire product's secondary marked on base/chase/autos by selling large quantities of cards cheap on release day (see latest Bond set).


I know dealers need to make more money; to stay in business; so we can keep buying cards from them - but frankly I don't think many collectors could afford to pay more at the moment and I'm quite happy for one dealer or several to 'set the market' as you put it if it means more collectors can add nice cards to their collection.

Besides, the people selling cheap only have so much product to go around which will eventually dry up and collectors will pay a little more in the end. And for all the buyers who score a card at $10 I see plenty of others paying double that in other auctions for the exact same thing.
Plus we can't 'blame' just big dealers can we? Set formats have changed and when you have sets made up entirely of rare cards today's 'Limited' and 'Very Limited' cards are the new 'common' cards. Just because a card is designated as a 'Very Limited' or such does not automatically mean a buyer can be gouged. The actor/character/actual rarity are the real factors when it comes to pricing.

Buyers are the ones who set the market and will pay only what they are willing to pay. I don't see why ANY card should cost a certain amount, I mean how much do you think a 'Limited' or 'Very Limited' auto from the new Bond set should cost? What in particular is being undersold? Should Brosnan & Craig be $1000 a piece?


X, I would expect that you for one would greatly enjoy the prices on this set. Wink

As for Mission Logs, I would have never made money on my case, but with the prices that were set right out the shoot (not so limited quantities with a dealer who likely busted 15+ cases) the loss on the case will likely end up at about 55% of the cost. The same dealer was selling Brosnan autos for $399 when most estimates had that as a $650-$800 card.

While the early seller does not have unlimited quantities, the buyers' mentality on ebay is if the first one went for $400 then I should be able to get one for $390 then $375 then $350 and so on. Do that to the majority of the cards that you will pull from a case, and you are looking at a big fat loss.

That is why I love the sketch card releases, especially those from the likes of 5finity, Sadlittles, BadAxe and am really looking forward to Vampirella by Breygent. Not everybody is pulling the exact same cards, so each is sold on it's own merrit.

____________________
Feeling happy? Then rip open a box. Feeling blue...then rip 2!
 
Posts: 1492 | Location: Tinley Park, Illinois, USA | Registered: May 31, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by igman7:
quote:
Originally posted by X:
quote:
Originally posted by igman7:
People are just too used to paying next to nothing for base/chase sets, in part do to some of the big busting dealers blowing things out from day one...which sets the market (and ruins it in many cases). One guy, if he breaks enough, can ruin an entire product's secondary marked on base/chase/autos by selling large quantities of cards cheap on release day (see latest Bond set).


I know dealers need to make more money; to stay in business; so we can keep buying cards from them - but frankly I don't think many collectors could afford to pay more at the moment and I'm quite happy for one dealer or several to 'set the market' as you put it if it means more collectors can add nice cards to their collection.

Besides, the people selling cheap only have so much product to go around which will eventually dry up and collectors will pay a little more in the end. And for all the buyers who score a card at $10 I see plenty of others paying double that in other auctions for the exact same thing.
Plus we can't 'blame' just big dealers can we? Set formats have changed and when you have sets made up entirely of rare cards today's 'Limited' and 'Very Limited' cards are the new 'common' cards. Just because a card is designated as a 'Very Limited' or such does not automatically mean a buyer can be gouged. The actor/character/actual rarity are the real factors when it comes to pricing.

Buyers are the ones who set the market and will pay only what they are willing to pay. I don't see why ANY card should cost a certain amount, I mean how much do you think a 'Limited' or 'Very Limited' auto from the new Bond set should cost? What in particular is being undersold? Should Brosnan & Craig be $1000 a piece?


X, I would expect that you for one would greatly enjoy the prices on this set. Wink

You're not wrong!

As for Mission Logs, I would have never made money on my case, but with the prices that were set right out the shoot (not so limited quantities with a dealer who likely busted 15+ cases) the loss on the case will likely end up at about 55% of the cost. The same dealer was selling Brosnan autos for $399 when most estimates had that as a $650-$800 card.

While the early seller does not have unlimited quantities, the buyers' mentality on ebay is if the first one went for $400 then I should be able to get one for $390 then $375 then $350 and so on. Do that to the majority of the cards that you will pull from a case, and you are looking at a big fat loss.

I do know what you are saying about the 'buyer mentality' thing but using your example, even though the first Brosnan on eBay was $400, there were PLENTY that came after that one that were going for $500-$700 every time. It's only now (a month after release that they are stabalising around the $400 mark, which I don't think is too bad for a card limited to approx. 150-200 cards. As another example, I saw a Ricky Jay auto sell for about $8.00 and later that same day someone snapped up another for $33 when other cheaper BINs were available. Sometimes the buyers just don't make any sense! But it is a shame if you genuinely cannot make your money on a set as good as Mission Logs. The last couple of Bond sets I would agree with you that dealers I]are[/I] undercharging e.g. $10 for Gabriele Ferzetti = BARGAIN!!! but it makes a change from the previous overcharging which was more rampant than it is now.

That is why I love the sketch card releases, especially those from the likes of 5finity, Sadlittles, BadAxe and am really looking forward to Vampirella by Breygent. Not everybody is pulling the exact same cards, so each is sold on it's own merrit.


Despite the uniqueness of sketch cards, would it not be fair to say that the final prices of sketches have taken a bit of a tumble as well? Is it product over saturation? The economy? Buyer fatigue????
 
Posts: 3124 | Location: England | Registered: June 23, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post



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By all means, the hobby has softened overall. there have been tons of sketch cards sets done that were met with lukewarm response. By and large, the cost on the "premium pack" sketch releases are cheap enough that one can at least scratch and claw their way back to even or better even on "flops".

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Posts: 1492 | Location: Tinley Park, Illinois, USA | Registered: May 31, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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there are alot of good sketches to be found at around £10 or so.some the wizard of oz ones im buying are stunning.jeff chandler's are amazing!!
 
Posts: 182 | Location: runcorn | Registered: January 23, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The main issue I have with sketch cards is that theres that one you saw listed on the artist checklist you really want and can t find,when its probably still in a sealed box in a won't be opening til doomsday case Razz

i ve been collecting katie cook since the beginning of 2008,this year (so far) i ve spent £3645.22
thats just for 41 (including one still lost in post) cards
yes i am crazy Razz
 
Posts: 1212 | Location: u.k. | Registered: February 02, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by cheifbrody:
The main issue I have with sketch cards is that theres that one you saw listed on the artist checklist you really want and can t find,when its probably still in a sealed box in a won't be opening til doomsday case Razz

i ve been collecting katie cook since the beginning of 2008,this year (so far) i ve spent £3645.22
thats just for 41 (including one still lost in post) cards
yes i am crazy Razz


Did you see that thuy past the 300 mark on Cooks...just crazy...dude is on a mission
 
Posts: 860 | Location: Alaska | Registered: May 28, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Chuck Bartowski:
quote:
Originally posted by cheifbrody:
The main issue I have with sketch cards is that theres that one you saw listed on the artist checklist you really want and can t find,when its probably still in a sealed box in a won't be opening til doomsday case Razz

i ve been collecting katie cook since the beginning of 2008,this year (so far) i ve spent £3645.22
thats just for 41 (including one still lost in post) cards
yes i am crazy Razz


Did you see that thuy past the 300 mark on Cooks...just crazy...dude is on a mission


yep,thuy (when i last looked) had 323,hes doing really well, this year alone hes probably picked up 3 times as many as me. and paid 3 times as less than i paid for my 41 (including one lost in post) his last pick up was a lot of 23,i couldn t do that as i m very picky and hand pick each one i buy,i have 133 but it doesn t mean i love her less Razz
 
Posts: 1212 | Location: u.k. | Registered: February 02, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by cheifbrody:
i ve been collecting katie cook since the beginning of 2008,this year (so far) i ve spent £3645.22
thats just for 41 (including one still lost in post) cards
yes i am crazy Razz

Well no, I don't think you're crazy because you are doing what you enjoy and can afford to do it. But I would pose this question based on the responses from some serious sketch collectors here . . .

Are the higher priced sketch cards, and consquently the most sort after artists, overinflated or is there still room for the prices to increase after the initial buy?

I ask this because many of the best known current artists are by no means limited in their potential work. They are young, they are engaged in numerous products, sketch cards are fairly common to most releases, they should be producing in one form or other for many years to come. Although every sketch is viewed as a 1/1, the artist's body of work makes up the supply. As long as demand keeps pace or exceeds the supply, prices will hold or go up. But the higher the price, the more it shaves off the demand. Not because people don't still want it, but because the cost is prohibitive and the sketch is viewed in a much narrower light. Many collectors will drop $30 on a nice sketch card, $300 not many at all. Wink

I see dozens of sketch cards that are moderately priced and that are really attractive. Then I see the big names with followings and three figure tags no matter what the item and I think that most of the sketches have no where to go but down.

Just my opinion, I have a few nice sketch cards, but when I buy sketches I am more interested in the subject rather than in collecting any specific artist.
 
Posts: 9725 | Location: New York | Registered: November 20, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I really don't think that most of the collectors are buying with speculation in mind. About 80% of the time, you will get less for something when you resell it years later (unless you got a steal or unusual circomstances come into play) that is just the nature of the hobby.

You also not just say a Cook (or McHaley, Pence or insert name here______) should be worth less from the brand new set because they have done tons of sketches in other sets. Each set has a life of it's own and set collectors or new artist collectors can be fighting over the cards from THAT set and not others.

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Posts: 1492 | Location: Tinley Park, Illinois, USA | Registered: May 31, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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"Hulk say - sketch card GOOD! Hulk say - no argue with HULK!"

 
Posts: 2487 | Location: USA | Registered: November 08, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by cardaddict:
"Hulk say - sketch card GOOD! Hulk say - no argue with HULK!"



I agree with Hulk. Big Grin
 
Posts: 2187 | Location: Ontario, Canada | Registered: September 20, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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