Yes, I agree that it has kind of run it's course too. Like xSaBx said, I am glad it came up and that everyone has given us their feedback and input. We have definitely heard you and will consider what the community has said when accepting future ads. For now, I'll leave the topic open and hope that it runs its course like xSaBx also said.

Visit Non-Sport Update at www.nonsportupdate.com

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Originally posted by Bill Mullins:

Let me understand. We have an ad which clearly portrays women of a particular race as sex partners, yet I have a problem because I point this out????

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No,no.no.You have a problem because you said that the subjects of the AE set come of more like hookers than the Playboy sets despite the ad showing less flesh and you not having seen the actual set,the fact that if race,colour or creed is mentioned then it must be racsist which is not always the case.

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And if the distinction between a set which simply has naked women and a set which focusses on naked women of a particular racial group continued to escape you, I would think you to be somewhat dense.

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No it has not escaped me.What we disagree on is whether it is racist to release a set based on race.

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Yes, there have been many sets over they years which portrayed mostly white women. But I can't think of any which defined themselves by their whiteness. In other words, there haven't been any sets named "Caucasian Concubines", "Wet White Wimmen", "Klan Hotties", or the like. If there had been, then yes, I would think they were racist. But lacking that, they are simply pornographic (or possibly only sexist, depending on the content).

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Well if I go by porn films as an example it was predominantly white preformers,therfore when non whites started making them it was put in the title so the target audience knew what they were getting.I see no difference with the AE set.

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If I have inflamed you, why use a smiley emoticon? Have the courage of your convictions. Close out with something that shows anger.

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I didn't feel you inflamed me,I felt you were inflaming the set and the models in the set(of which you have only seen an ad for).The smiley was to show you I felt no malice towards you,not even anger,but to try and bring some lightness back to this heavy discussion.

Simply put calling someone Asian because they are is not racist.Because they are naked does not make it a racial stereotype.

Kevin

Rufus: Very basic strategy. If your enemies know where you are then don't be there!

Greetings:
I would like to comment that I am partially responsible for the creation of the Studio E ad regarding the release and sale of the Asian Ecstasy Series One cards. I am a Vice-President in the company. I offer no apologies. In fact, I am very proud of the work and dedication the company and myself put into this endeavor. As far as the Non-Sports Update advertisement is concerned, nudity was not shown and it was covered up in order to comply with the rules and regulations of the magazine. Someone typed, I know what's under there (referring to the words 'Hot Asian Desires' over the model's breasts.) Guess what? So do I! I guess we both pass anatomy class this semester. The controversial ad that ran on p.41 was as it appeared to be: sexy, alluring, and provocative. Hinting at nudity can be more exciting than baring it all. One should remember that any ad can be censored by the magazine itself. Point of fact, it ran across the editor's desk for approval. Another point, the model was of legal age, not exploited, and nothing indescent was displayed. If you look at the ad for the Sports Illustrated series, there is definite nudity seen through the mesh swimsuit top. I can see the model's ******. Yes, I typed ******! This is more revealing and blatant than the Studio E advertisement. I didn't have to figure out what was under there. I don't hear people screaming about this.
Also, you have to remember the product itself. Asian Ecstasy shows female nudity plain and simple. This is not a hardcore sex pictorial like the new Wicked cards. The Wicked cards show both male and female body parts up close doing what they are intended to do. Doesn't this set cater to a both genders? Asian Ecstasy is a first on many levels in the Adult trading card business. This is the first mass scale Asian trading card set produced in the United States. The models in the series range from being well-known such as: Teanna Kai, Mimi Miyagi, Stephanie Swift, Asia Carrera to newcomers like: Tai Lee, Kasorn Swan, Kat, and Joanna Choo. {edited} This is what the advertisement is intended to do -- motivate its audience to purchase the item. Albeit, the target audience is mostly male. Is there another more precise publication to advertise trading cards to the card market in? Studio E chose Non-Sport Update magazine. Doesn't Playboy advertise its product in this magazine as well. It is listed in the price guide. If you are a Buffy or Alias fan you would like to know when your favorite set will be available, wouldn't you? What's the difference in alerting people to a product they might like.
On another point, who decides what is tasteful? This is a free country. I for one would not let anyone tell me who to vote for let alone decide what I am allowed to see and not see. If you don't like what you see turn the page. If you hear something offensive on the radio, or see something distasteful on television, switch the stations and channels or turn them off. Why are people in the world so tormented over something so mundane? There are better causes worth fighting for. People who mull and waste time over this subject of what is good and what is bad should ask themselves, is there something else better that I can do with my time?
I am aware that people have their own opinions. I respect that. You can't please all of the people all of the time. I can live with this. Finally, if you rain on my parade, I'll probably use an umbrella. I hope this message explained a few things. I didn't write it to change minds out there on the information super-highway. I just wanted to broaden them a little.

Thank you,

AM Liali, Vice-President Marketing and Production, Studio E

This message has been edited. Last edited by: H_Toser,

Hi Am Liali:

That's great. Isn't it wonderful.

Please note that we do not allow free advertising here on Card Talk. You can read our FAQ, located here. I have removed those parts of your message.

Harris

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Originally posted by H_Toser:
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That's great. Isn't it wonderful.

...

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Hi Harris, this is the first time I've read this thread and this last comment just made me laugh, after all that's been said on the topic, sorry just had to say it, what an anti-climax ... great reply

And a good morning to you too!

Why after 2 years is this being brought up again??

Beats me . Oh, and thanks Rita.

Are they re-issuing the cards or got a new set out. Is this the longest ever wait for a reply???

This message has been edited. Last edited by: hammer,

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Originally posted by Fire8rays:
Why after 2 years is this being brought up again??

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You can't count on a pornographer to do anything responsible.

Maximus i hope you have a good lawyer.

I also find it strange that it has taken so long for the company to post this responce but it is nice that they have bothered to do so.

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Originally posted by Maximus:
You can't count on a pornographer to do anything responsible.

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Please watch it, Maximum. And as Wolfie says, you better might seek council . And for heaven's sake, don't do anything more then will make NSU need council!

Hi

It might just be me, and I don't doubt that many of you will regard me as some stupid Welsh prude, but as you mention, we are fortunate enough to live in the "free world" where everyone is allowed an opinion. Even the Welsh, and even me! So don't shout me down for what I am proclaiming is my personal opinion and I am in no way telling other people what they should believe.

I find all of the playboy, benchwarmer etc. ads in NSU just plain tacky, they bring down the whole tone of the magazine which I find, has been in parts an interesting and refreshing read. We aren't 14 any more, and those who are 14 are unlikely to look for this in a card collecting magazine. I work in the IT industry and as I was growing up I trawled through this rubbish in industry magazines. However the IT industry has realised that IT professionals are getting older, have families and are not all seeking this stuff, especially not in a magazine dedicated to other endeavours.

Current magazines for the gaming aspect of my industry have completely banished this trash (like Edge), so I am just waiting for the non sport industry to grow up too. In fact it is the only thing stopping me from subscribing to Non Sport Update, I pick it up in the shops when I see that it has an article on a set I am definitely interested in collecting. Perhaps this means that I am missing out on some good stuff but I have a 5 year old daughter and I don't wish her to find this and let her think that this is the opinion that her father has of women. I acccept that these women are consenting etc etc but I would hazard a guess that 99.999% of women would not take their clothes off for money.

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Originally posted by Glyn Jones:
Hi

It might just be me, and I don't doubt that many of you will regard me as some stupid Welsh prude, but as you mention, we are fortunate enough to live in the "free world" where everyone is allowed an opinion. Even the Welsh, and even me! So don't shout me down for what I am proclaiming is my personal opinion and I am in no way telling other people what they should believe.

I find all of the playboy, benchwarmer etc. ads in NSU just plain tacky, they bring down the whole tone of the magazine which I find, has been in parts an interesting and refreshing read. We aren't 14 any more, and those who are 14 are unlikely to look for this in a card collecting magazine. I work in the IT industry and as I was growing up I trawled through this rubbish in industry magazines. However the IT industry has realised that IT professionals are getting older, have families and are not all seeking this stuff, especially not in a magazine dedicated to other endeavours.

Current magazines for the gaming aspect of my industry have completely banished this trash (like Edge), so I am just waiting for the non sport industry to grow up too. In fact it is the only thing stopping me from subscribing to Non Sport Update, I pick it up in the shops when I see that it has an article on a set I am definitely interested in collecting. Perhaps this means that I am missing out on some good stuff but I have a 5 year old daughter and I don't wish her to find this and let her think that this is the opinion that her father has of women. I acccept that these women are consenting etc etc but I would hazard a guess that 99.999% of women would not take their clothes off for money.

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You've got a good point, several actually. There are definitely some mixed messages when you look at a magazine that has an ad for U Go Girl a few pages apart from a Benchwarmers ad. You could not ask for a more striking contrast between empowerment and objectification. Taken in context with a wonderful article about a young boy's collecting bug it's all the more confusing. If the industry is going to survive we need products like Robots and Harry Potter and U Go Girl to connect with the next generation of collectors like the young man in the article by Meg Charendoff. But at the same time we have to admit that the majority of the collector market is adult. I am not personally offended by these ads, I tend to just ignore them, but I could see a parent being careful about what their child is exposed to and not wanting them to have this magazine just because of that one Benchwarmer ad (and possibly the Dawn ad). That's a real shame because taken as a whole this would be a fantastic issue for kids to expand their interest into card collecting. I understand that the market is not huge and that NSU is obviously going to be grateful for any ad they can sell. It's a tough call to have to make but it might actually have a long term effect on the health of the industry down the road. I'm not trying to make judgements here, I guess I'm trying to ask questions more than anything. Yeah yeah I know, old thread, dead subject etc.. but it might just be something that bears regular consideration.

QB

Glyn - First of all, welcome to Card Talk! It's good to have you here. I must say that you certainly do start things off with a bang!

For the most part, you'll find that the Card Talk members are never shy about expressing their opinions, but we always try to respect the right of someone to express their opinion, whether or not we always agree. Your opinion is important and we welcome the insight of our members, especially the newer ones.

The members here are certainly a varied lot. We have IT gurus, ministers, stay-at-home moms, salesmen, etc. We have people here who love heavy metal music, classical music, new age music, etc. We have members from about a dozen different countries too. All of these different types of people with their vastly different backgrounds all share in common their love of non-sport cards.

Our members have different tastes in the cards they collect. Some go for Star Trek cards, while some go for Buffy. Others collect Playboy cards, and still others collect artwork cards.

I said all of that to ask this - to whom should NSU advertising be specifically targeted? First and foremost, NSU is a business. We're fortunate that the family who owns and runs NSU are good & decent people. They have not hesitated in rejecting advertisements that they deem too risque' for their magazine.

Cards such as Playboy, Benchwarmer, etc exist. People collect the cards, which is why they're produced. Within certain boundaries, NSU accepts advertising from these companies and others in order to defray the cost of the magazine, pay for this very Card Talk forum, and make a living for its employees.

While NSU tries to appeal to the widest base of hobbyists as possible, there are always going to be some who have occasional concerns. I think you'll find that as long as those concerns are presented in a respectful and intelligent manner as you have done, people will listen. We members may not always agree with each other, but we do try to respect one another's opinions.

Again, welcome to Card Talk! We're glad to have you here!

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Kennywood,

Kevin - Well said! Are you sure you aren't a Toser?

I'm the son Marlin & Roxanne always wanted...

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Originally posted by Kennywood:
I'm the son Marlin & Roxanne always wanted...

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Nooooo! I thought I was the son that Marlin and Roxanne always wanted!
I guess that makes me Harris's evil twin.

Which presumably makes me the son they didn't know they wanted...
Au Res.,
Paul

Now now boys - no fighting over Mom and Dad