Non-Sport Update's Card Talk
NYCC 22 Review

This topic can be found at:
https://nonsportupdate.infopop.cc/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/6236037711/m/9877034996

October 14, 2022, 12:26 PM
A_Biegel
NYCC 22 Review
Missed this year's New York Comic Con? Read my review at https://www.beckett.com/news/author/alanbiegel/

~Alan
October 14, 2022, 01:49 PM
wolfie
Thanks for the report, looks like a lot of fun to be had. Thumb Up

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October 14, 2022, 04:05 PM
Ted Dastick Jr.
Very nice! I really wish Topps would put forth the effort to exhibit at the Philly show - that Adam Bomb fortune teller machine would be awesome!
October 16, 2022, 03:58 AM
hammer
Great review, looks like a great show
October 19, 2022, 06:00 AM
Electrawoman Cards f/k/a jane
quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
Very nice! I really wish Topps would put forth the effort to exhibit at the Philly show - that Adam Bomb fortune teller machine would be awesome!


Topps would do well to exhibit at Philly since I had sooooooo many people ask for GPK over the weekend.

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October 19, 2022, 10:10 AM
Ted Dastick Jr.
quote:
Originally posted by Electrawoman Cards f/k/a jane:
quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
Very nice! I really wish Topps would put forth the effort to exhibit at the Philly show - that Adam Bomb fortune teller machine would be awesome!


Topps would do well to exhibit at Philly since I had sooooooo many people ask for GPK over the weekend.

It's baffling. Both Scranton and NYC (where they have offices) are literally 2 hours away. They can put forth the effort to do shows all over the country, not to mention drive a truck from one ocean to the other... it would require almost zero effort to bring that stuff to the Philly show. They don't want to pay 2 employees to work a weekend at a show where people will go nuts for their products? I don't get it.
October 19, 2022, 12:48 PM
Bill Mullins
I doubt Topps could hold a booth for less than $10k. Do you think doing so would yield more than $10k in profits that they wouldn't otherwise get? Everyone who attends already is aware of Topps -- it would be "preaching to the choir", so to speak.
October 19, 2022, 02:55 PM
Raven
I know everyone keeps saying Topps here, but really the old Topps card division doesn't exist anymore. Not that the old Topps might not have been absent either, perhaps they would have been, but no one can say. The name is still on the masthead, but it's Fanatics in charge now, and how committed they are to non-sport products is anybody's guess.

Maybe they don't believe they need to do as much at shows to promote their cards, if the cards are selling out anyway. Heck, if the cards are selling through in Dutch auctions or whatever, they don't need to do anything.
October 19, 2022, 05:44 PM
Ted Dastick Jr.
quote:
Originally posted by Raven:
I know everyone keeps saying Topps here, but really the old Topps card division doesn't exist anymore. Not that the old Topps might not have been absent either, perhaps they would have been, but no one can say. The name is still on the masthead, but it's Fanatics in charge now, and how committed they are to non-sport products is anybody's guess.

Maybe they don't believe they need to do as much at shows to promote their cards, if the cards are selling out anyway. Heck, if the cards are selling through in Dutch auctions or whatever, they don't need to do anything.

They haven't been at a Philly show since long before the Fanatics acquisition.

To Bill's point above - everything they would set up at Philly is already done (save for the few dollars it would cost to have some new promos to give out). There's no way they would incur $10k in expenses to set up a few things at the Philly show. The Adam Bomb fortune teller machine was probably in an office or warehouse last weekend when it should've been put to good use at the show. With the crush of GPK collectors there, that would've been huge.

Also, there were other shows going on over the weekend at the Oaks Convention Center. They could've brought that truck there that they drive all over the country and attracted even more attention than just the Philly Show attendees.
October 20, 2022, 12:15 PM
Bill Mullins
quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
There's no way they would incur $10k in expenses to set up a few things at the Philly show.


I came up with $10k by rectal extraction, but let's run some number:

Figure a smallish booth, not the sort of big thing that would happen at Comicon or some place. Smaller than this. A display case of product, banners, a couple tables and chairs.

You'd need at least two people. I don't know what Topps pays the sort of folks who run trade show booths, but I wouldn't be surprised by a loaded (salaries + benefits) rate of $100k per year. Assume a 50 week work year, that's 250 days. One person-day of labor is $400. Send two people, that's $800 a day. Just getting to and from the booth means setup Thurs, travel Fri, show Sat + Sun, travel Mon, tear down Tues. 6 x $800 is $4800 labor, assuming no weekend overtime.

Travel expenses: We'll use GSA rates for Philly as a proxy for commercial costs. Hotels are $200 per night per room, plus another $80 for per diem. 3 travel days x 2 persons x $280 = $1680.

Travel: A van plus gas for the weekend is $500 minimum.

Booth equipment (tables, chairs, displays, cases, carpet, lights) -- $1000 rental easy.

Someone's got to coordinate this -- book the booth, book rooms, rent van, rent equipment, cut checks, file travel vouchers on return, pack & unpack equipment booth equipment. Figure one more day's labor -- $400

So we're up to $8380. We haven't allowed for the cost of any product to give away. We haven't designed and printed a custom promo for the show. We haven't brought any guests, like artists. We haven't even paid for the booth. This is just the minimum to show up.

It is not cheap for a company to display at a trade show.
October 20, 2022, 01:44 PM
Ted Dastick Jr.
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Mullins:
quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
There's no way they would incur $10k in expenses to set up a few things at the Philly show.


I came up with $10k by rectal extraction, but let's run some number:

Figure a smallish booth, not the sort of big thing that would happen at Comicon or some place. Smaller than this. A display case of product, banners, a couple tables and chairs.

You'd need at least two people. I don't know what Topps pays the sort of folks who run trade show booths, but I wouldn't be surprised by a loaded (salaries + benefits) rate of $100k per year. Assume a 50 week work year, that's 250 days. One person-day of labor is $400. Send two people, that's $800 a day. Just getting to and from the booth means setup Thurs, travel Fri, show Sat + Sun, travel Mon, tear down Tues. 6 x $800 is $4800 labor, assuming no weekend overtime.

Travel expenses: We'll use GSA rates for Philly as a proxy for commercial costs. Hotels are $200 per night per room, plus another $80 for per diem. 3 travel days x 2 persons x $280 = $1680.

Travel: A van plus gas for the weekend is $500 minimum.

Booth equipment (tables, chairs, displays, cases, carpet, lights) -- $1000 rental easy.

Someone's got to coordinate this -- book the booth, book rooms, rent van, rent equipment, cut checks, file travel vouchers on return, pack & unpack equipment booth equipment. Figure one more day's labor -- $400

So we're up to $8380. We haven't allowed for the cost of any product to give away. We haven't designed and printed a custom promo for the show. We haven't brought any guests, like artists. We haven't even paid for the booth. This is just the minimum to show up.

It is not cheap for a company to display at a trade show.

I think you're shooting for the stars, here. This does not need to be a massive comic-con setup. In past Philly shows they've had a table, put out some displays, had some signage behind the table and that was about it. They don't need to go whole hog here, just show up!

I don't know what it costs for a table for a manufacturer, but Topps would probably want 2. Load up the stuff into a small van, send 2 employees with the van, give them off Monday and Tuesday since they're working Saturday and Sunday... this is not a huge expense.
October 20, 2022, 02:03 PM
H_Toser
quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Mullins:
quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
There's no way they would incur $10k in expenses to set up a few things at the Philly show.


I came up with $10k by rectal extraction, but let's run some number:

Figure a smallish booth, not the sort of big thing that would happen at Comicon or some place. Smaller than this. A display case of product, banners, a couple tables and chairs.

You'd need at least two people. I don't know what Topps pays the sort of folks who run trade show booths, but I wouldn't be surprised by a loaded (salaries + benefits) rate of $100k per year. Assume a 50 week work year, that's 250 days. One person-day of labor is $400. Send two people, that's $800 a day. Just getting to and from the booth means setup Thurs, travel Fri, show Sat + Sun, travel Mon, tear down Tues. 6 x $800 is $4800 labor, assuming no weekend overtime.

Travel expenses: We'll use GSA rates for Philly as a proxy for commercial costs. Hotels are $200 per night per room, plus another $80 for per diem. 3 travel days x 2 persons x $280 = $1680.

Travel: A van plus gas for the weekend is $500 minimum.

Booth equipment (tables, chairs, displays, cases, carpet, lights) -- $1000 rental easy.

Someone's got to coordinate this -- book the booth, book rooms, rent van, rent equipment, cut checks, file travel vouchers on return, pack & unpack equipment booth equipment. Figure one more day's labor -- $400

So we're up to $8380. We haven't allowed for the cost of any product to give away. We haven't designed and printed a custom promo for the show. We haven't brought any guests, like artists. We haven't even paid for the booth. This is just the minimum to show up.

It is not cheap for a company to display at a trade show.

I think you're shooting for the stars, here. This does not need to be a massive comic-con setup. In past Philly shows they've had a table, put out some displays, had some signage behind the table and that was about it. They don't need to go whole hog here, just show up!

I don't know what it costs for a table for a manufacturer, but Topps would probably want 2. Load up the stuff into a small van, send 2 employees with the van, give them off Monday and Tuesday since they're working Saturday and Sunday... this is not a huge expense.


You are right Ted. That is how they have set up previously and it's nothing too elaborate. This is how Cryptozoic, Rittenhouse, and SideKick set up. I mean a San Diego or NYCC booth would be awesome but it is not expected at this point.

I remember years ago (maybe 15 years ago), we (NSU) would take our stand up display and you might see a few others with them - I kind of remember Bench Warmer having one as well as Sports Time (remember them?) and one or two others but no one has these anymore.

Their expenses would likely be pretty small. They'd have to pay the employee(s), give-aways, possibly some shipping, and that's about it. They could probably even give the off during the week to make up for their time on the weekend.

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October 21, 2022, 02:59 PM
Bill Mullins
> This does not need to be a massive comic-con setup.

And I didn't describe a massive set up -- "Figure a smallish booth . . . A display case of product, banners, a couple tables and chairs."


> Load up the stuff into a small van, send 2 employees with the van,

You are describing just what I costed out.


> give them off Monday and Tuesday since they're working Saturday and Sunday

Topps still has to pay for their time, whether it's on duty, or paid time off.

I've had to budget for personnel to go on trips in my day job. It is not cheap, and all the things I mentioned have to be paid for one way or another.
October 21, 2022, 11:37 PM
catskilleagle
I don't think Topps would print special promos for every show. They cut back on promos in general at least ten years ago It's an extra expense on top of the travel cost and the show cost even if they are just sending "two guys in a van." It seems the company realized years ago that people going to the Philly show were already buying their products. They want go to a Comic-Con to let a wider segment of the collector population, potential customers, know what they have face-to-face. They'll go all-out for that.
October 23, 2022, 01:25 PM
Ted Dastick Jr.
quote:
Originally posted by catskilleagle:
I don't think Topps would print special promos for every show. They cut back on promos in general at least ten years ago It's an extra expense on top of the travel cost and the show cost even if they are just sending "two guys in a van." It seems the company realized years ago that people going to the Philly show were already buying their products. They want go to a Comic-Con to let a wider segment of the collector population, potential customers, know what they have face-to-face. They'll go all-out for that.

For them to tack on a few thousand cards to an existing run would incur little to no additional expense. They already do cards for the show, what's one more to have at their table? Plus they send door prizes.

They have a massive presence at The National convention, where every single person walking in already knows Topps. Something like Comic-Con is definitely beneficial to reaching a new audience. All I'm asking is that they SHOW UP here! When a company like Cryptozoic can send someone across the country to set up, there is ZERO reason why Topps can't do the same when it's practically in their backyard.

And back to Bill's points, I think you're still overestimating, but I don't want to argue that any more. I have also planned out trade show setups for my day job. Setting up at the Philly show doesn't have to blow any budgets.
October 23, 2022, 03:49 PM
catskilleagle
I don't know for sure why Topps doesn't set up at the Philly show. It seems like a no-brainer for a trading card company to do that one but I have set up at trade shows for two different companies in two different fields. It is often a necessary pain for a company unless it's looking for ways to cut back on expenses. A lot of companies in tech have stopped doing trade shows. COVID didn't help. There are signs the trade show thing might be coming back but when a company can sell just as well with a website visible on a cell phone they aren't going to want to pay for things that seem minor like signage costs, travel costs, and show costs even if the venue is just two hours away.


quote:
Originally posted by Ted Dastick Jr.:
quote:
Originally posted by catskilleagle:
I don't think Topps would print special promos for every show. They cut back on promos in general at least ten years ago It's an extra expense on top of the travel cost and the show cost even if they are just sending "two guys in a van." It seems the company realized years ago that people going to the Philly show were already buying their products. They want go to a Comic-Con to let a wider segment of the collector population, potential customers, know what they have face-to-face. They'll go all-out for that.

For them to tack on a few thousand cards to an existing run would incur little to no additional expense. They already do cards for the show, what's one more to have at their table? Plus they send door prizes.

They have a massive presence at The National convention, where every single person walking in already knows Topps. Something like Comic-Con is definitely beneficial to reaching a new audience. All I'm asking is that they SHOW UP here! When a company like Cryptozoic can send someone across the country to set up, there is ZERO reason why Topps can't do the same when it's practically in their backyard.

And back to Bill's points, I think you're still overestimating, but I don't want to argue that any more. I have also planned out trade show setups for my day job. Setting up at the Philly show doesn't have to blow any budgets.